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a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building

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#1 2018-10-27 06:53:09

jasonrohrer
Administrator
Registered: 2017-02-13
Posts: 4,750

As some of you noticed

There were some changes that I forgot to mention in the update email.

Disconnects are fixed, in that the server doesn't kill you when they happen.  As long as you don't starve to death or die of some other in-game cause, you catatonic body will remain alive in-game.  If you ever reconnect, you re-enter that body.  This is great in situations when your network breaks temporarily.

It also removes a method of suicide.


Finally, a rather small change to the mother-baby relationship:  you cannot jump out of your mother's arms until age 3.  Those of you who think that newborns can jump out of their mother's arms at will haven't spent much time around newborns.

If you REALLY don't want to stay with your mother, communication with her will be important.  Emotes should help with that.  She will put you down at some point so she can feed herself.

Jumpy babies were always a pain to deal with (even the ones that wanted to stay), and the mother really should be in full control of this special time.  I was very hesitant for a long time to make the first few minutes of the game entirely powerless.  What kind of brand new player experience is that?  But a two things have changed.  First, brand new players experience power right away through the tutorial.  Second, it has become clear to me that any decent baby-player gives the mother full control anyway.  The power to jump out isn't really more than a power to be annoying and be a sub-optimal baby.  So, I think this really makes the game better overall, and should have been there in the beginning.

(By the way, I've never been entirely satisfied with the boring nature of the mother-baby part of this game.... usually a lot of standing around waiting, unless food is in short supply.  I want it to be better than "just wait for three minutes to be over," but I haven't worked out how that part of the game can be more dynamic, with more drama and interesting choices.)



Now, I know that people's time is limited, and I respect that.  If you've only go one hour, you don't want to waste it in some sub-optimal situation.


But...

That's really what this game is about.

Like I said many times before, if this is a game where you can pick your situation, the UI that I designed for making that choice is really terrible (baby suicide).


People just can't understand why I won't just give up and make the game that they want to play.

I hope---I really hope---that part of the reason that you're playing this game is that it's so DIFFERENT than other games out there.


I could add a birth location picker, and respawn mechanics, and a damage health bar, and an inventory bar, and all the other things that every other game has.


And some of these things are the kind of thing that would make you play more.  Like, if you could easily respawn and keep working on the same project, I might hook you into playing for 8 hours straight.  And that would be great!  You'd like the game more, and tell more friends about it, and I'd make more money.


But, given that there are loads of games out there that do those things already, what would be the point?


The point, for me, is always to break new ground.  To do things that have never been done in a game before.  To not compromise with general practice.  To not sand off all the sharp edges that make a thing unique and interesting.

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#2 2018-10-27 08:09:24

The_Llamacorn
Member
From: Sweden
Registered: 2018-04-01
Posts: 183

Re: As some of you noticed

Yes, I support that completely. I don't want the game to be like every other game, I think most people came here because it was so different. Even though people think they want all these things, that lots of other games have, if you add them they'll get bored because it stopped being unique. Keep it up Jason <3


Noobs are fine, but noobs that don't listen and refuse to learn, get on my nerves. Your ignorance will lead you to Donkey Town one day.

"Hugs from grandma"
-Rose Winter

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#3 2018-10-27 08:10:32

Aurora Aurora
Member
From: Tuppsala (HAHA FATTAR NI!?!?!)
Registered: 2018-04-09
Posts: 839

Re: As some of you noticed

Thanks. I like this.

But! Can you starve while disconnected?


One of the original veterans.
Go-to person for anything roleplay related.
4 years in the community.
Unbanned from the discord.

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#4 2018-10-27 09:12:34

Aurora Aurora
Member
From: Tuppsala (HAHA FATTAR NI!?!?!)
Registered: 2018-04-09
Posts: 839

Re: As some of you noticed

Nevermind I hate it


One of the original veterans.
Go-to person for anything roleplay related.
4 years in the community.
Unbanned from the discord.

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#5 2018-10-27 09:36:29

Potjeh
Member
Registered: 2018-03-08
Posts: 469

Re: As some of you noticed

The baby phase would be a great time to communicate if the mother had a reasonable character limit. As it is, most of the time I simply don't bother, because getting cut off mid-word while trying to explain anything is just so damn frustrating.

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#6 2018-10-27 10:01:17

voy178
Member
Registered: 2018-08-18
Posts: 290

Re: As some of you noticed

Edgy games are kind of a lot, it's always good to have some conventional features when you break new ground. If not just revolutionise the gaming industry by deleting the EXE and call it art. Right?

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#7 2018-10-27 12:14:28

Catfive
Member
Registered: 2018-07-27
Posts: 256

Re: As some of you noticed

jasonrohrer wrote:

(By the way, I've never been entirely satisfied with the boring nature of the mother-baby part of this game.... usually a lot of standing around waiting, unless food is in short supply.  I want it to be better than "just wait for three minutes to be over," but I haven't worked out how that part of the game can be more dynamic, with more drama and interesting choices.)

Papoose would be a good start so mum can keep playing with baby attached.

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#8 2018-10-27 16:50:52

Lum
Member
Registered: 2018-04-03
Posts: 406

Re: As some of you noticed

Never give up Jason. Stay true to your vision of your game. I hate it when people think they have a right to influence anything whatsoever about the making of this game


ign: summerstorm, they/them

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#9 2018-10-27 17:10:23

kcmcc2
Member
Registered: 2018-06-02
Posts: 6

Re: As some of you noticed

Jason--thank you so much for this! I love this update!

I tend to play the game like "this is the life I'm given, it may not be optimal, but I'll make the most of it." I think this speaks to the original intention of the game. But it's hard to play this way when babies keep suiciding left and right.

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#10 2018-10-27 17:54:06

Anshin
Member
Registered: 2018-04-01
Posts: 614

Re: As some of you noticed

Ooo make babies crawl, so even if mom has to put them down they can't run like a rabbit to starve behind a tree.

I love the growth elements of the game. The baby cries and the evolving speech is brilliant!

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#11 2018-10-27 18:02:19

Tarr
Member
Registered: 2018-03-31
Posts: 1,560

Re: As some of you noticed

Anshin wrote:

Ooo make babies crawl, so even if mom has to put them down they can't run like a rabbit to starve behind a tree.

I love the growth elements of the game. The baby cries and the evolving speech is brilliant!

I really don't think breeding contempt between people who want to force you to stay and people who don't want to play in a spot is a good idea. I'm already seeing more bear pokers instead of instant suicides. All forcing people to stay is going to do is lead to people turning around and griefing your camp because you made them stay somewhere they didn't want to.

I prefer the way it is now though to how it was before hand. Removing the instant suicide means at least babies aren't dumping their bones in the middle of town and are now at least dropping off on the sides where people don't have to clean up their mess as often. Plus we get the added bonus of being able to reconnect after a server/internet hiccup which is great.


fug it’s Tarr.

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#12 2018-10-27 20:08:09

pein
Member
Registered: 2018-03-31
Posts: 4,329

Re: As some of you noticed

cat really think of interesting stuff as baby

as a mom i miss out on work

should be some small bonus to their growth

increase normal weapon held time to 20, also limit each clothing like shoes 2 year old, pants 3, body 4, pack 10, apron 20
baby intelligence would be a skill, esentially would add up to years until twenty, unlocking clothes

moms would need an UI for trainign kids, step left, right, find a medium tile spot, etc.
also small task on gathering like a quest
get 5 kindling or clay or a basket made
plant milkweed or water bushes, put soil on berry

this would be a quest, this things are always needed so not that bad to enforce it, so toddlers would work to unlock clothing slots


https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=7986 livestock pens 4.0
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=4411 maxi guide

Playing OHOL optimally is like cosplaying a cactus: stand still and don't waste the water.

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#13 2018-10-29 08:01:49

FeverDog
Member
Registered: 2018-07-10
Posts: 96

Re: As some of you noticed

I get your point Jason but the suiciding is really breaking the game because there isn't any way to deal with it.  I understand not taking a heavy hand with griefers and the bear pokers (and these at times can add some interesting expereince) but the suiciding babies is too much and I wish you would deal with it.  It's so disheartening when you've spent a lot of time getting improvements on line or fixing a broken village and then there aren't any more females.  I personally enjoy doing the menial crap in this game (hauling mutton, corpses, bussing plates, etc.) because I enjoy the experience of participating in a collective effort towards a shared beneficial outcome but if it's all for nothing then I'm much less inclined. 

I do appreciate that there are already loads of games out there that are similar but this game is already very different with the complex tech tree and other aspects that I don't think you'd lose anything by being more heavy handed with the suiciding.  I see here that you are trying and it's much appreciated.

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#14 2018-10-29 08:37:34

tana
Member
Registered: 2018-06-04
Posts: 202

Re: As some of you noticed

FeverDog wrote:

It's so disheartening when you've spent a lot of time getting improvements on line or fixing a broken village and then there aren't any more females.

tbh i feel that's not really caused by suiciding babies..... the real reason is the lack of players.
At this moment it's morning in europe and there are usually  around 20 players on the server , then it slowly raise to 30 in the afternoon with maybe a peak to 50-60 when americans start joining in, can go up to 70-90 as both regions play at the same time (but lately such high number got rather rare) then it's late night for europeans and the numbers go decrease again slowly as more and more go to bed. I don't really know how the numbers hold after that since i'm usually in bed, i'll need an american player that can tell us what the numbers are on average once us europeans are asleep.

I hope that with the steam release, there will be a substanciate increase in the player base so that there will be enough players to solve that problem.


I will be eve tana. If not an eve, my kids will be called numerically : Primo, Duo, Tertio, Quattro, Quintus, Sextus, Septimus, Octavius etc... ending with an -a if you're a girl.

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#15 2018-10-29 09:16:12

VioletLily
Member
Registered: 2018-07-27
Posts: 201

Re: As some of you noticed

tana wrote:
FeverDog wrote:

It's so disheartening when you've spent a lot of time getting improvements on line or fixing a broken village and then there aren't any more females.

tbh i feel that's not really caused by suiciding babies..... the real reason is the lack of players.
At this moment it's morning in europe and there are usually  around 20 players on the server , then it slowly raise to 30 in the afternoon with maybe a peak to 50-60 when americans start joining in, can go up to 70-90 as both regions play at the same time (but lately such high number got rather rare) then it's late night for europeans and the numbers go decrease again slowly as more and more go to bed. I don't really know how the numbers hold after that since i'm usually in bed, i'll need an american player that can tell us what the numbers are on average once us europeans are asleep.

I hope that with the steam release, there will be a substanciate increase in the player base so that there will be enough players to solve that problem.

This definitely is a factor, but so is suiciding babies. Due to my not having a set sleep-schedule, I play at completely random times of the day and have experienced both quite regularly.

I've had lives where I had over 10 kids who all suicided. That means I pretty much had a baby right after my birth cooldown ran out each time. The people who were suiciding constantly were preventing me from giving birth to a player that wanted to stay.

Other times, I have gone whole lives with only one kid (suicide or no) due to lack of players.

Either way, Jason is currently thinking of ways to help solve these issues with both the steam release and the possibility of a /die command you can use as a baby that bans you from a lineage.

Last edited by VioletLily (2018-10-29 09:22:53)

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#16 2018-10-29 12:18:32

tana
Member
Registered: 2018-06-04
Posts: 202

Re: As some of you noticed

or it was the same 1-2 players again and again, 10 babies doesn't necessary mean 10 different babies


I will be eve tana. If not an eve, my kids will be called numerically : Primo, Duo, Tertio, Quattro, Quintus, Sextus, Septimus, Octavius etc... ending with an -a if you're a girl.

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#17 2018-10-29 19:12:26

VioletLily
Member
Registered: 2018-07-27
Posts: 201

Re: As some of you noticed

tana wrote:

or it was the same 1-2 players again and again, 10 babies doesn't necessary mean 10 different babies

I never meant to imply it was 10 different players. I simply meant 10 babies. The ones in the game. It makes no difference whether they are the same player or not in this case, at least not until the /die command is implemented.

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#18 2018-10-29 21:12:40

tana
Member
Registered: 2018-06-04
Posts: 202

Re: As some of you noticed

VioletLily wrote:
tana wrote:

or it was the same 1-2 players again and again, 10 babies doesn't necessary mean 10 different babies

I never meant to imply it was 10 different players. I simply meant 10 babies. The ones in the game. It makes no difference whether they are the same player or not in this case, at least not until the /die command is implemented.

it does make a difference, since if it's the same player, he keeps puting you on cooldown while suiciding, if you rotate among the same players always respawning to you, they already know they don't want to stay.

If it's really 10 different players, at least one of them usually is bound to stick with you... unless your premices are so shitty that it isn't encouraging anybody at all, but the chances of that are small since usually seasoned players like that kind of challenge.


I will be eve tana. If not an eve, my kids will be called numerically : Primo, Duo, Tertio, Quattro, Quintus, Sextus, Septimus, Octavius etc... ending with an -a if you're a girl.

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#19 2018-10-29 21:44:31

TrustyWay
Member
Registered: 2018-03-12
Posts: 570

Re: As some of you noticed

After many edits (~30), here my final version of my shit block :

You can do what you want jason, it's your game. We always have been trying to help you, not pushing you into our personal preferency, maybe sometimes. But anyway, we all suppprt you. It wont change that the game was really more of an experience than now. I'm sorry.

I know this isn't in your vision anymore but remember, remember when the game was popular, it's because that was the moment where it was really enoyable to play. This was more of a true unique experience, even more than now, and now nobody could ever do it again.

The additions of items, food and murderer and griefer tweaks which have been really usefull and great. Therefore...

Does anybody do trades, skirmish or wars now ?
No.
Does anybody do make roads, temples, crypths now ? No.
Did anybody started a new cults since ?
No.
Does anybody is interessed in anything else more than farming ?
Not really.

Richs to apes rather...
People don't have the same relation between them as before.


The feeling of love for familly you're a trying to make us feel has been already there since day 1, you're trying to achieve something you already achieved. For exemple Give somebody a crown and he is the king, except when people clearly told people they weren't king, they all assumed they were the ruler. Give somebody a mother and it's the same thing. This is personal but it feels you are maybe pushing this family thing too much. We wont talk about the zoom thing further but we know that it is the same thing.

I'm sorry to be that negative, jason, but I had to say, maybe repeat, these things.

When the only persons you can talk to are your family bc no neighboor ever, then it's not really your family, just inmates in the same prison.

I would love and do more for my family if I had to compet against others familes than being stuck with related strangers.

Last edited by TrustyWay (2018-10-29 22:30:56)

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#20 2018-10-29 21:48:38

VioletLily
Member
Registered: 2018-07-27
Posts: 201

Re: As some of you noticed

tana wrote:
VioletLily wrote:
tana wrote:

or it was the same 1-2 players again and again, 10 babies doesn't necessary mean 10 different babies

I never meant to imply it was 10 different players. I simply meant 10 babies. The ones in the game. It makes no difference whether they are the same player or not in this case, at least not until the /die command is implemented.

it does make a difference, since if it's the same player, he keeps puting you on cooldown while suiciding, if you rotate among the same players always respawning to you, they already know they don't want to stay.

If it's really 10 different players, at least one of them usually is bound to stick with you... unless your premices are so shitty that it isn't encouraging anybody at all, but the chances of that are small since usually seasoned players like that kind of challenge.

Truthfully, I think we may be arguing two completely different things. I don't disagree with anything you are saying.

Whether these issues are separate or intertwined, or whether one is the sole reason or not, or whether one causes more of a problem than the other or not, was not the point I was trying to make.

My point was that Jason is putting solutions into effect for both. The issue will be remedied regardless.

I am aware that our player base is small, but Jason is launching the game on steam which will help. This will increase the number of players who may want to stay.

I am also aware that the people who are suiciding are keeping babies who want to stay from being born to mothers who need them. The /die command will help this. It will prevent suiciding players from keeping mothers from giving birth to players who want to stay.

Both issues are going to be rectified. That was the only point I was trying to make. smile

Last edited by VioletLily (2018-10-29 21:56:53)

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#21 2018-10-31 14:49:17

Stormyzabeast
Member
Registered: 2018-09-26
Posts: 150

Re: As some of you noticed

Tarr wrote:
Anshin wrote:

Ooo make babies crawl, so even if mom has to put them down they can't run like a rabbit to starve behind a tree.

I love the growth elements of the game. The baby cries and the evolving speech is brilliant!

I really don't think breeding contempt between people who want to force you to stay and people who don't want to play in a spot is a good idea. I'm already seeing more bear pokers instead of instant suicides. All forcing people to stay is going to do is lead to people turning around and griefing your camp because you made them stay somewhere they didn't want to.

I prefer the way it is now though to how it was before hand. Removing the instant suicide means at least babies aren't dumping their bones in the middle of town and are now at least dropping off on the sides where people don't have to clean up their mess as often. Plus we get the added bonus of being able to reconnect after a server/internet hiccup which is great.



+1


I am Eve Toadvine. I name my kids Alex, Jason, Jake, Holly and Disney characters. Forager and road builder extraordinaire!

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#22 2018-10-31 15:01:53

Anshin
Member
Registered: 2018-04-01
Posts: 614

Re: As some of you noticed

Stormyzabeast wrote:
Tarr wrote:
Anshin wrote:

Ooo make babies crawl, so even if mom has to put them down they can't run like a rabbit to starve behind a tree.

I love the growth elements of the game. The baby cries and the evolving speech is brilliant!

I really don't think breeding contempt between people who want to force you to stay and people who don't want to play in a spot is a good idea. I'm already seeing more bear pokers instead of instant suicides. All forcing people to stay is going to do is lead to people turning around and griefing your camp because you made them stay somewhere they didn't want to.

I prefer the way it is now though to how it was before hand. Removing the instant suicide means at least babies aren't dumping their bones in the middle of town and are now at least dropping off on the sides where people don't have to clean up their mess as often. Plus we get the added bonus of being able to reconnect after a server/internet hiccup which is great.



+1

The forcing people to stay aspect was fixed with the /die command, which I think was implemented very well.
Crawling babies would still be cute though. smile

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#23 2020-04-18 20:34:03

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 4,291

Re: As some of you noticed

jasonrohrer wrote:

(By the way, I've never been entirely satisfied with the boring nature of the mother-baby part of this game.... usually a lot of standing around waiting, unless food is in short supply.  I want it to be better than "just wait for three minutes to be over," but I haven't worked out how that part of the game can be more dynamic, with more drama and interesting choices.)

Now, I know that people's time is limited, and I respect that.  If you've only go one hour, you don't want to waste it in some sub-optimal situation.

But...

That's really what this game is about.

Like I said many times before, if this is a game where you can pick your situation, the UI that I designed for making that choice is really terrible (baby suicide).

People just can't understand why I won't just give up and make the game that they want to play.

I do understand, because I've seen why in many other instances: because Jason doesn't respect gamers making their own choices.

jasonrohrer wrote:

I could add a birth location picker, and respawn mechanics, and a damage health bar, and an inventory bar, and all the other things that every other game has.

By no means does that hold true.  And it didn't when Jason wrote the above.  Pac-man doesn't have a way to pick one's initial conditions, nor do any of the original Super Mario Brothers games.  As a more recent example, people don't pick their starting location in the recently released Final Fantasy VII Remake (though maybe it's a rework).

jasonrohrer wrote:

And some of these things are the kind of thing that would make you play more.  Like, if you could easily respawn and keep working on the same project, I might hook you into playing for 8 hours straight.  And that would be great!  You'd like the game more, and tell more friends about it, and I'd make more money.

But, given that there are loads of games out there that do those things already, what would be the point?

Suspiciously, it wasn't asked that given that there exist loads of games that don't let players pick their starting location, why would a game let players pick their starting location.

jasonrohrer wrote:

The point, for me, is always to break new ground.  To do things that have never been done in a game before.  To not compromise with general practice.  To not sand off all the sharp edges that make a thing unique and interesting.

Players not having the ability to choose their initial conditions doesn't break any new ground.  Not in games in general and not in computer games.  Does anyone think that in Spacewar! players could choose their own starting conditions?  Or what about all the arcade games which predated the console games of the 80s, which the console games were imitations of?  It wasn't like players got to pick their initial conditions in Pong.

Players having no choice on how to pick their initial conditions is an old and tried idea.  The newer idea consists of where games enable players to choose their initial conditions.

Last edited by Spoonwood (2020-04-18 20:38:24)

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#24 2020-04-18 22:35:54

sigmen4020
Member
Registered: 2019-01-05
Posts: 850

Re: As some of you noticed

Neat necro.


For the time being, I think we have enough content.

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#25 2020-04-18 22:43:22

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 4,291

Re: As some of you noticed

Thanks sigmen.

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