a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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jasonrohrer wrote:How did it take away playing in beginning towns?
Veteran players take the long view. When they look at a shallow well, they are thinking about what they need to do to turn it into a deep well. When they see a deep well, they are thinking about the steps required to turn it into a necomen pump.
And when they see a single-race village, they are thinking of how much work it will take to find blacks, browns, and gingers before the water runs out.
....
That's how race restrictions have ruined the early village experience. As an experienced player, it is hard to relax and enjoy building a young village, far away from the big cities, knowing that there is an almost impossible roadblock looming in the immediate future. It is a lot harder to get invested, when you know that your work is probably wasted in an isolated village or off-shoot town. You might as well /die until you reach a bell-town. That's a lot faster than walking by foot.
Not all experienced players WANT to play in crowded bell towns, but that is the "best" solution to the problem presented by race restrictions in the current meta. It dooms many villages, because people will abandon the town to head to the nearest bell, if it is available. There's no point in staying.
Just want to add that this guy hit the nail on the head. This is why race restrictions are bad.
I like the idea of different families having specialties. that's kind of cool. But the hard restrictions force certain playstyles. You have to make a bell town or die, and bell towns tend to be pretty terrible and/or boring.
It's no surprise to me that the game is having a rough time keeping a population active right now. And as the population drops the problems only get worse. Not to mention the constant racial griefing that occurs because of it--what better way to screw over a town than to kill off the only chance they have for x resource? And you can pretend to be a genocidal maniac--trolls and griefers eat this crap up and ask for seconds.
I don't think racial restrictions are bad. I just think that hard restrictions make the game unplayable unless you play an exact and specific way, and this just isn't fun. It's a big part of why I quit playing previously, and a big part why I don't come rushing back. I really like this game, but this flaw ruins it for me. The best I can hope for is to get into a new town and enjoy it for a brief period of time until it inevitably blows up--figuratively and possibly literally.
If it were up to me--and it obviously isn't--I would keep racial restrictions but not make them hard restrictions. Make it so any race can work on any biome, but that they will struggle to do so if they are not the correct race. How? Well that's up to Jason. I just ask that it would be possible, even if it's impractical, to get a small amount of what you need to simply survive without living off of goose eggs and swamp water and constantly migrating. Or, going into the hell that are super bell cities.
But it's just my opinion. Perhaps not an entirely uncommon one, but these aren't my choices to make. I can only hope that future updates will expand what people can do instead of further restrict what is possible. I just want to be able to play the game and have fun.
I had this happen once but it was late at night and I was intentionally bombing my yum score because I was out exploring and I didn't want babies.
Any time I've kept my yum score going high, I've never had literally zero babies. And I've had cases where I was intentionally bombing my yum score and had like 7 babies anyways. (All but one died... because I was in the wilderness and there just weren't resources to feed that many, and babies kept running off.)
Because I'm not spiteful, and I don't take pleasure in watching other people suffer and fail?
If you're asking why a griefer would not want to take the risk, there is no answer except that they don't want to be cursed. A smart griefer can do a lot more damage than stabbing someone, watching them get healed, and getting cursed by the entire town while they bleed out from getting stabbed by literally everyone in town. But I am not about to advise on that.
It looks like we have veteran players who know what to do, but no way for them to teach other people?
Let's assume the hierarchy system will actually work, and Alice, a veteran player, will become everyone's leader. What would be the best way to organize a town full of noobs? Again, assuming that they only know basics but are willing to do what she tells them to do.
If ~30 minutes of teaching is not enough, and she'll get more done by doing everything on her own, then maybe we need to make training easier. What would be the perfect tool for teaching people really fast?
In order to teach players, players have to be willing to listen. That's the real challenge.
I'd also love to see town notice boards to help coordinate jobs and warn about shortages.
This is a really good idea, btw. I heartily support it!
Its "end tech" for a reason.
Also those things are so useless at the moment that the people who can actually make them tend not to. I've build dozens of engines but never made it to a car. The engine serves just much better as a pump. If you make a car you eventually are just making a tool of grieffing as people just burn all the oil that could be used to water for pointless joy rides.
Maybe if the kerosene use duration on car would be much much longer people would consider these as an option for transportation.
Like lets say you put kerosene to a car and it will run one lifetime (hour). This way you could actually consider the option of cars super fast speed over the horse cart. With time being the kerosene consumption is just too over the top to ever consider using em. Dont know if we would lose even more cars to even further distances, but hey thats the nature of the game with every item. Eventually some moron picks it up and drops it into his/her retarded den or fails it somehow.
I mean sure but, they are not used for non-cars either. I've seen oil used one time... to power a well. Most of the time an engine powered well is a death sentence for the water in that town.
I definitely agree that the time per usage is ridiculous (2 minutes per kerosene? lol).
Oh, there is a car. If you are in bell town aka Mafia City go north-east in straight line for 0.2k, but it has got empty tank.
Solution to end with self-killing would be to conquer others, but it's easier to kill ourselves.
If newest update would works, I suggest - make a lock, a key, store all knives and bows there, a car too, also kerosene, and let the leader hold the key and pass it to next leader.
Yeah I mean, this would be intelligent. The problem is knowing whether the next leader can be trusted. Either by whether they are actually trustworthy, or whether their judgement is sound.
Kinrany wrote:Bowser wrote:While I do not see guards, well... ever, I do see doctors all the time. If I don't see one, I make an effort to be that doctor. The problem is as soon as people are comfortable all they do is start griefing eachother and any kind of resource we can use to get ahead goes unused. And being a doctor that is healing morons killing each other and wasting pads that literally no one is making an effort to replace is just a massive waste of time.
Maybe the solution is to start killing people who are not working. Sounds harsh, but something has to give... although I suspect it would just play into more random griefing and killing and accomplish nothing in the end, so it wouldn't necessarily be worth it.
It seems the solution is to continuously kill off people who stir trouble. If people are comfortable, there are enough resources to keep a few guards.
This is probably harder than it sounds, because people who don't like this boredom will keep coming back.
But I'm assuming it's also too hard to organize. Why? Someone would say that we're missing some kind of social technology.
It's very possible that, come a week or two from now, we have the hierarchy system used for the purposes of organizing a "town guard". The leader is simply whoever's the oldest of the group and can organize the rest.
We can dream.
Yeah I've never seen anything beyond tier 3. By the time we get enough families to build anything, people start killing eachother and then the family we need to get the resources dies and we're back to square one. Resources start getting low and people begrudgingly start working so they don't starve... usually involving long trips to wells far away. Eventually, we find that family we need again and for a brief time things are well. Then the cycle repeats. I'm sure it's not just because of the family specialty update, but it is a major barrier moving forward.
While I do not see guards, well... ever, I do see doctors all the time. If I don't see one, I make an effort to be that doctor. The problem is as soon as people are comfortable all they do is start griefing eachother and any kind of resource we can use to get ahead goes unused. And being a doctor that is healing morons killing each other and wasting pads that literally no one is making an effort to replace is just a massive waste of time.
Maybe the solution is to start killing people who are not working. Sounds harsh, but something has to give... although I suspect it would just play into more random griefing and killing and accomplish nothing in the end, so it wouldn't necessarily be worth it.
As far as I can tell, it's not possible for a town to progress into any kind of technology that requires engines or kerosene.
1. You need a bell town if you want to get enough families together to have a shot at making oil (need rubber plus gingers for oil itself).
2. As soon as you make a bell town, people get lazy and start trolling instead of doing anything useful. Usually just random murder and griefing.
3. Anyone who does try to help gets ignored and due to tool slots, it's very difficult to build things up yourself... let alone in a single lifetime. And you'd spend a lifetime doing all this work for a town that would squander the resources and waste them as soon as they got them...
What's the solution here? You need a bell town to get enough families to trade, but getting a bell town means everyone is going to go full stupid and start trolling instead of anything remotely useful. Due to tool slot limitations we can't even just do this stuff on our own, if we had time and resources (that weren't being wasted) to begin with.
I have yet to see a single car or engine get used ever, let alone a plane, since I've started playing about two weeks ago. Is it just no longer possible to reach higher tech because people become too stupid to do it because the town gives them basic resources?
Let alone that the second that anyone actually managed to get this stuff going, a griefer or idiot would take the cars/planes into the wild and lose them, intentionally or accidentally, doesn't matter.
Are we trapped in low-tech nightmare now, where we can't even fix our wells for water? What's the solution? Because I don't see one...
Marrying into other families is kind of cool. I don't know if the statistics above this post would make sense, but I agree with the principle.
In almost every case, lineages die because they got griefers and weren't prepared for it (MAKE PADS!!!), or because it's in the early hours on the morning and there's a shortage of players... or either of these combined with bad luck on births and/or females who don't realize how critical their role is and die to stupid things.
Obviously the apocalypse that occurred today didn't help, and made starving a real danger, but that's not exactly happening daily.
If baby doesn't want to join me, baby doesn't want to join me. It's fine. Better than forcing them to join me and making my life hell once they get bored and bust out a knife and we have to put them down and deal with their mess... or you know, just play badly or go afk or whatever. I don't mind SDIs, they typically do not affect me in any way.
The only exception I have to this is a case where I saw that a baby had sudden infant deathed over 20 times on a mother in a lineage that was actively being griefed--to the extent that the family died off. Circumstances like this are pretty rare.
Bowser wrote:Unfortunately killing is a necessity on a number of levels, and if you couldn't kill players griefers would have a field day. That idiot pulling bears? He can now do it without any danger to his or herself.
I didn't mean to suggest that such dangers from wild animals end. Death from hungry grizzly bear is different in the causes of death than murdered if I recall my terms correctly.
Um... what? You do realize that players can just knock on the door of every bear cave until the bears come out, then lure them to town, right? That a griefer can do this with every bear cave for kilometers around and if you can't kill them, there's nothing you can do but continually fight off bears. And if you don't have the arrows and bow to stop them, you are going to get overwhelmed trying to lure them out of town.
This is a very common griefing tactic that is easily dealt with by killing the player doing it. Remove that, and he can do it over and over and over until he dies, eating your food to keep himself alive and you can't do anything about it.
Bowser wrote:That player stealing from your supplies? No danger, easy to do.
It's fairly easy to do with murder in the game.
Uh, no, it's not. I once saw a guy steal rubber in a cart from bell town and get chased down by three players with knives because he was a thief. He died, of course, and he had it coming. In your world, this guy could steal it and laugh and mock and troll the entire town with them helpless to do anything but curse them in vain, if they haven't already used up their tokens to begin with because griefing would be everywhere if there was no consequence to doing it (being killed).
Bowser wrote:Not to mention a ton of mechanics in this game are based on being able to fight and kill other players.
Huh? I don't think the coding of the game works that way.
The apocalypse for instance, as well as warring. There is killing in this game that isn't just blatant griefing that leads to interesting stories and I'd hate to see it go, though to be fair these are not things I feel strongly about.
You may argue that the apocalypse is not necessary and maybe that's true. But there is benefit in wiping a map, especially if the inhabitants are not willing to do what is needed to save it. Sometimes civilization needs to be reset. I wouldn't be heartbroken if it was removed, mind you, but still.
Bowser wrote:I think that killing is too easy and that's the problem, but it has its place and it's necessary.
I still fail to see how it's necessary.
Every single argument you've made basically ends up with "abandon your town and let the griefer ruin it without any punishment because killing is 'bad'".
So basically every single time a griefer finds your town, you have to leave, hope they don't follow you and hope your family survives the journey... over and over and over, because killing is 'bad'. I'm sorry but I don't buy this at all. I do not think you are thinking through the consequences of what removing the ability to kill would do in this game, and dramatically underplaying the consequences.
I think that we need non-violent ways to counter griefers but killing absolutely must stay in the game if we are going to play a game where griefers do not control (and ruin) the game for everyone. There simply is no way around this.
I am guessing that the reason you hate killing is because it's the primary reason why lineages die. I sympathize with this. However, the real reason killing is successful is because people are never prepared. Someone gets stabbed and you don't have people ready to stop it, you don't have medical supplies on hand and the world is more likely to end than finding someone who knows how to heat a knife to treat an arrow wound.
Any time someone died because there are no pads available, it makes me want to scream. No one takes threats seriously, and then they die. Murder is so easy to counter but families die because they don't take the threat seriously. What we need are better tools to counter griefers, not to take away the only tool we have to stop them.
The tool slot system is a crappy gimmick that everyone hates, there's no doubt about that. Same with family specialization. It's his way of updating without doing any real work to add content.
Earlier today I was exploring and finding nothing but dead towns as usual. Decided to settle in and repopulate with my children. The town's only fire died because I couldn't kindle hot coals. Apparently adding kindling to restore a fireplace counts as using the hot coals tool slot. This system is beyond stupid.
I noticed this the other day. Ironically adding Kindling to a mid-sized fire does not count as a tool slot. Go figure. Why low tech 'tools' like this even exist in the first place are a mystery...
Bowser wrote:If there was no danger for griefing (no way to be killed), players would have a field day griefing a town.
Abuse hungry work, eat the entire town's food and waste all their wood.
Griefers could do such things, yes. But, they have a reputation for lacking intelligence. So, I really don't know how many griefers would figure out how to game hungry work or how to fire grief.
Also, so what if they could wreck a town? The question isn't whether or not they could wreck a town more easily. The question is could they destroy lineages more easily if they didn't have murder?
The problem here is that you are running off of assumptions. Griefers can be stupid, but they can also be smart. The worst griefers are already doing these things behind the scenes... do you really think a bear randomly found your town? That your primary building got jacked up by accident? No, someone did that on purpose. The difference is in this case they could do so blatantly and you couldn't do anything to stop them.
Bowser wrote:They can't kill directly, but they can still run off with your baby and dump them in the wild. And you can do nothing to stop them.
They can't do that if women hold their children.
Another poor assumption, for a number of reasons. First of all you do not know if they are intentionally killing your children until it is too late. Secondly, and more critically, a mother will often times have more than one baby to care for... she can't leave 2-3 babies to save one. This is natural instincts. Last, and not least, anyone who can't nurse can literally just hold onto a baby until it starves, and you can do nothing to stop them if the baby is too young to escape.
Bowser wrote:Or how about trapping you in property fences, or putting your entire food supply inside of it?
I think elder fence removal exists. But, no, really are you building those things? Property fences aren't good in general, and Jason apparently is still trying to prove that they can have value, AFTER MONTHS OF THEM EXISTING. That's Jason for you... it takes him a long time before he even seems to consider that an idea of his could be seriously flawed, if he ever admits his idea as flawed.
Oh yeah, elder fence removal does exist. You need an elder with a spare tool slot, as well as someone else in order to remove them. And you may not (almost certainly won't) have time to save starving players if the paper is not already ready to go, let alone the knife. Had a griefer who did this yesterday, we didn't have a knife up so we couldn't remove the fences and almost everyone involved starved. If it were not for a bow I crafted, said player would have still been griefing wherever they could. But I did have that bow, and they did get killed off. We were only able to save one person, and it's the absolute shittiest way to go.
Bowser wrote:The list goes on and on.
They can't grief all of the wild food or grief all of the resources on the post or pre-rift map. It's still open as to how the prospects of lineage survival would change were it the case that murder didn't exist. Migration is possible after all.
Migration is just as likely to kill off a family as a griefer at times. Too easy to get separated, too hard to keep kids alive with babies popping constantly and mothers starving themselves to feed everyone. Especially making a significant journey.
Bowser wrote:The fact that your third suggestion is to "migrate farther away because of griefers" points out just how flawed this is, sadly... it is both completely ineffective (because griefers can still potentially be born to the family) and a bad necessity even if it could work -- you have to move away from civilization out of fear of a single griefer? Really? Why should you have to punish yourself because of a single idiot?
Uh... so we had a low pop griefer on the server I usually play on a while back. Killing sheep and hacking up trees, extremely excessive reed skirts, tried to make an old style pine-wall building looting everyone's milkweed. The smithy I had built didn't meet the expectations I had for it in terms of temperature, so I worked on destroying the walls and the griefer told me "good job", I guess not suspecting that I was the person who ran the town. Destroying adobe walls may be more difficult than destroying anything else in this game, but I digress. Anyways, two other people decided to make new camps off of the road, because of that griefer. I think they just ran from the road to their hideouts. I also made a new town, but I did so on an new Eve spawn, so I think I started it up differently, just running away from where I had seen rabbits (later I learned that my guess about the nearby town location was more or less correct). Painful? No, not really. Boring? No.
Were it the case that I had to live like I was in DonkeyTown sure, that would get dry and dull. But, having started over basically because of a griefer, I'm not quite so sure it's as bad you think. I could be wrong here though, because maybe there would be sooo many more breakaway camps without murder in the game, I don't know. But, strange enough, griefers rarely target Eve camps and when they do people generally have expressed surprised, because it's rather rare and said things like "who the hell griefs an Eve camp?". So, if your family migrated, I'm skeptical to say the least that you would get targeted by them again.
Uh, I was targetted as an Eve by 1-3 different players (depending on how many accounts they had), and it was the worst griefing I ever experienced, so I can definitely say that you are mistaken in saying that Eve camps are not targetted... they definitely are, because griefers know how vulnerable they are. You get someone like I am describing in a camp like this and you will have a 0% chance of survival, it's hard to survive at times even without a griefer.
I mean I can respect your opinion, I hate murder and I wish this game could exist without it, but the simple fact is that the alternative is worse, much worse in fact. There are a lot of ways to counter murderers, but no way to counter the griefers I am talking about above in a world where you can't kill them. I'd love a way to disarm and imprison them, however, as opposed to killing, for a large number of reasons. But that is not likely to ever happen since it would be used by the griefer rolepalyers who 'enslave' people or whatever.
The sad truth is that we need to be able to kill players because it's better than the alternative.
I'd love this.
tool slots just make me suicide which I haven't really done that before
we got some high tech stuff like grapes, photo and other things, but so hard to tell people to work in your own family, not even talking about others
like 5 gingers ignored e totally, they read the note I wrote and still until I found someone to care enough to do the oil part
I can tolerate a tool slot limit, but it's way too low by default, and some tools just don't make sense.
I cannot fathom why stone hatchet and axes are different tool slots (or why hatchets count as tools at all, really). I cannot imagine why charcoal pencils count as tools, either. I didn't realize they were until today when I went to sign a notice to knock down a fence a griefer put up.... only to find I couldn't do it because I used up my very limited tool slots.
Aside from endgame crafting where tons of tools are required and lots of specializations are used, these tool slots only seem to exist to prevent you from managing a town. Several times since the reset I've been in towns that direly needed help in multiple areas, and I felt completely helpless because I could only use six tools... and everything counts as a tool. People aren't farming, people aren't baking, people arent shearing the sheep, no one knows how to smith... I want to help but there's only so much I can do because of the tool slot limitations. And this says nothing of being an Eve, I pity any Eve (or second gen) who can't further their very basic town because of a cheesy tool slot limitation.
I think tool slots should only exist for high tech, or at least mid tech development, or should have a great deal of slots (at least 10) available by default so players don't feel useless. Alternatively, make it so tools are you ineffective with drain hunger or have some other detrimental effect that doesn't make you feel utterly useless. But hey, that's just me.
Toxolotl wrote:My main objection would be griefer management. Like jason mentioned in the other thread a griefer can basically torture people their whole life and ruin a town with no way to stop them.
But is killing the only answer? Maybe not.
A way ive thought about a few times would be if someone built up enough curses they would poof out of existence. This could be abused, and its also highly unrealistic.
Perhaps you could immobilize someone for a short time with the lasso.
That being said removing killing from the game is a stretch for me. Killing has been apart of human society forever. Removing it completely would be too unnatural imo.
Personally i think more tools to associate griefers and manage them would be useful. Non griefers have weapons and curses to fight griefers. Griefers have weapons, curses, bears, boars, wolves, theft, destruction, confusion and misdirection.
Would be nice to have as many tools to counter griefers as they have to grief.
Yeah it feels like some kind of "stun weapon" is missing... Maybe a whip or the lasso or something, although I'm sure that would quickly become a griefer favorite too, stunning bakers and smiths and such
If they attack someone in town for the lulz, they are probably going to get killed very quickly... probably by the baker who was using that knife to cut bread. Furthermore I'm of the opinion that you should be able to disarm griefers without needing a weapon, just that it should be much harder to do if alone than in a group of two or more.
jasonrohrer wrote:As I've said, killing is a necessary ingredient in this game... otherwise, how would you dispatch such a griefer, even with majority consent?
There's no reason to assume that a griefer has to get dispatched unless we know that the griefer would be destructive in terms of family survival if not dispatched. This was a mistake I made in my previous post, mostly because I was assuming trying to make a permanent town of sorts.
1. Suppose it were the case that 0 murders per life existed. No families would die out to murderous griefing then.
2. Suppose buildings couldn't get blocked off so easily OR that walls could easily get deconstructed by hand OR that buildings just weren't built for functional purposes as did happen for a long period of the game's history. In either of those cases people dying to starvation because of blocked off buildings (or city walls) doesn't seem like an issue.
3. Encourage more migration... especially if griefers were doing things which makes it difficult to advance a town.
That would seem to solve the issues with respect to griefers killing off lineages. How it would work in the context of bs2 and how players would react to it is NOT known, NOR do we have good enough information to know how players migrating due to griefing would be affected.
If there was no danger for griefing (no way to be killed), players would have a field day griefing a town.
Abuse hungry work, eat the entire town's food and waste all their wood. Speaking of which, light all kindling and chop all wood into kindling to light.
Take any item, especially horses, off away from town and hide/lose them. This is something players already do, but if caught are killed (stopped).
They can't kill directly, but they can still run off with your baby and dump them in the wild. And you can do nothing to stop them.
Or how about trapping you in property fences, or putting your entire food supply inside of it? Sure, you can find more food, but if you're trapped in a property fence, you're basically at their complete and utter mercy.
They can make you run out of water fast by doing the first trick with your crops. And they can burn all the seeds.
Speaking of which, they can murder all your animals and you can't stop them.
The list goes on and on. I'd rather deal with a murdering idiot that can have their damage relatively easily fixed (if you have pads/needle & thread) than deal with a griefer ruining the town that I could do literally nothing to stop. Yeah, you can curse them... so what. Even if they go to Donkey Town, they'll come back and find you.
The fact that your third suggestion is to "migrate farther away because of griefers" points out just how flawed this is, sadly... it is both completely ineffective (because griefers can still potentially be born to the family) and a bad necessity even if it could work -- you have to move away from civilization out of fear of a single griefer? Really? Why should you have to punish yourself because of a single idiot?
We don't need to remove killing, we just need to make it so it's not so easy to do.
For instance, one person with a knife shouldn't be able to kill ten people without one, just because they hid all the knives. A mob of people would overwhelm that one person with a knife, disarm them, and stop them with relative ease. But in OHOL, you can only attack if you have a weapon, so... rip.
I think you should be able to attack a player unarmed for no damage, but being able to stun them and remove their weapon. Multiple players doing it would make this faster, but it would be such that a person with a weapon would win one vs one in almost ever situation, but against groups, fail every time. A bow would have an advantage here in that they'd kill at least someone (if you didn't have a medic ready to go), but they'd get knocked down just as easily.
Ideally, there would be an item you could give to players in this state that would prevent them from using any weapons or tools (only being able to use food items, maybe) to prevent further griefing, as well.
Unfortunately killing is a necessity on a number of levels, and if you couldn't kill players griefers would have a field day. That idiot pulling bears? He can now do it without any danger to his or herself. That player stealing from your supplies? No danger, easy to do. Not to mention a ton of mechanics in this game are based on being able to fight and kill other players.
I think that killing is too easy and that's the problem, but it has its place and it's necessary.
Greifers certainly have been targeting specialist families. Just be glad they a little more spread out now. Late nights in the rift were a non-stop war zone of these cats.
My own family that I gave an example of was actually not really much of a specialist family. They were just white.
The problem (for me at least) is that a lot of families don't survive the journey. Especially women that are popping babies out on the way. I've migrated my Eve'd family before and not everyone survived the trip... people run ahead, people run the wrong way, people stop constantly. It can't be helped.
In general, it's especially frustrating when the only thing holding your entire town back is a single piece of rubber to fix a broken well from pumping. It would be nice if there was an alternative, highly convoluted way of getting makeshift rubber, similar to how you can mine gold from a vein but can also get gold from electrum if you play chemist well.
And this is saying nothing of the fact that simply surviving isn't an endgame that excites everyone. A lot of people want to thrive, to build up their tech tree and do exciting and fun things. This requiring trading is fine, but if you're constantly moving you are likely to be further and further from families until it's no longer practical to travel to them.
Bowser wrote:You could then administer punishment, either by killing them (I'd love to see proper tools for the job here, make it a public display--shame griefers)...
That would backfire so quickly. You'd have people griefing left and right just to get a special fancy public execution/punishment. It wouldn't be something shameful to the types of folk that'd get it, it'd be an achievement. Like the time people with high curse scores had white-on-black speech bubbles. People were begging to be cursed, and being assholes to towns just so they could get different colored text.
You're not wrong, but it would give everyone a great opportunity to curse them, and amuse and appease everyone who was pissed off by it. In the end, they would be unlikely to run into them again.
I doubt it would encourage them and in so doing make them any more active than they already are, but I could be wrong. The shame, though, would be that they were caught for doing it badly, not that they were caught for doing it. The execution would just be for fun (and be merciful), the real punishment would be forcing them to live out that life.
I don't think she was a griefer, I just think she was exhausted and didn't want to deal with feeding a bunch of doomed babies any longer.
This was right after the Steam sale and towns were dying at an alarming rate. Everyone was overwhelmed and burdened with way too many starving kids. Towns were collapsing left and right as the server was slowly buried in the white skulls of new players. Smart players weren't even trying to play, because it was like bailing water during a flood.
If she was a seasoned baby-killer, my sad face would not have been able to move her to feed me, even if she was clearly reluctant to do it. I didn't stick around to ask her deep questions about her motivations, but I suspect she thought a quick death-by-bear was better than a slow death by starvation. Or perhaps she just couldn't bring herself to get attached to a kid who would probably not survive to adulthood so she tried to end it quickly.
It wasn't excellent parenting by any stretch of the imagination, but I can understand her emotional state enough to not hate her or believe that she would be a horrible player under normal circumstances. Everyone has a limit and I think she had reached hers at some point before my birth.
An interesting way to look at it. I guess calling her a griefer is a bit harsh, but what made me think that was was the 'game' she was playing with you and your brother. Seems a little sadistic, honestly. Maybe she was just amused by your persistence and the irony of how the scenario played out. She definitely wasn't the type of person that was out to ruin someone's day, but rather to amuse herself.
Bowser wrote:I find it staggering that before the bell town went up, that one of the families I was getting born to was a staggering 3 km away from it. How are you supposed to find the bell town in that way, especially if you are traveling east... where civilization will inevitably die?
I know I've walked 4k on foot before in a life. If you leave early, 3k can get traversed on foot.
I think you misunderstood what I was trying to say.
Sure, you can make the journey on foot (back? Not likely. As female before old age? not likely, either).
But that was not the point I was making.
How are you supposed to randomly find another family when they are spread out by over 3km? It is not realistically going to happen. How do you even know which direction to go? Do you just depend entirely on the unlikely prospect of an Eve family spawning nearby and happening to find you? That's not very practical, especially when it's just as likely to be around a different family... or, you know, not at all.