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a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building

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#1 Re: Main Forum » Open later: Top cap for yum » 2019-03-11 14:29:43

futurebird wrote:

I don't understand why:

berry
bowl berry
popcorn
mutton pie
stew
burrito
berry


should be so much better than

berry
bowl berry
popcorn
berry
mutton pie
stew
burrito

just because the chain was broken. I think a more realistic "yum factor" would give a bonus to average diversity over say the last 40 pips eaten, not force you to try to remember the last 8 things you ate so you end up picking up food and putting it down again looking for yum. In reality both of the above would have similar health benefits for a real person. But in game the 2nd one is much worse.

Because first has 5 spaces between same foods while second has only 2 spaces and this is how yum works. BTW: berry bowl yum should be removed. My proposal is trivial to implement. Its probably two minute job. Yours is more complicated and punishes foods giving more pips (as you will eat less items before reaching 40 pips).
What is it with realism? Point of this discussion is making yum balanced, not realistic.

#2 Re: Main Forum » Open later: Top cap for yum » 2019-03-11 10:05:44

How about this: you can reach max e.g. 7 yum, but when you do you 2 or 3 bonus pips. So it rewards diversity, but not at pathological level.

This will allow town to specialize in food production as there will be no point to make all kinds of foods but some diversity will be very rewarding. Of course that limit and bonus can be tweaked, but 7 seems like reasonable challenge with nice reward of additional pips.

#3 Main Forum » Crazy idea: make high-tech life easier, not low-tech life harder » 2019-02-17 18:21:57

Alias
Replies: 18

So prediction was true, who would have thought that making life without clothes and buildings harder instead of making it easier with them would make civs before this tech (like, I don't know, EVE CAMPS?) miserable.

Who could have known?

#4 Re: Main Forum » Prediction: Jungles will be abandoned, eveing will be tougher. » 2019-02-17 18:09:43

Exactly: each biome has unique resources, but those in jungle are higher in the tech. Noone will settle there to rip benefits generations later. Just walk to jungle. And we can plant amngo trees I guess...
Thanks for info about shock after bite

#5 Re: Main Forum » Prediction: Jungles will be abandoned, eveing will be tougher. » 2019-02-17 10:03:18

Now that I think about it, going from jungle to colder biome after mosquitos bite you will shock-cool you instantly, so you are ready for the fever. At least there's that.

#6 Main Forum » Prediction: Jungles will be abandoned, eveing will be tougher. » 2019-02-17 09:54:24

Alias
Replies: 3

I just read the update. If jungles are now as hot as green/yellow biomes are cold then jungles will be completely abandoned. Why?
- mosquitos will be huge deterrent, especially that yellow fever will be worse in jungle.
- it's easier to gain heat (e.g. from fire) than lose it without crossing biomes. You can cool down with snow that comes from different biome.

All you gain from jungle is finite bananas - not good reason to build city in the jungle.

Desert also will be unlivable which is quite realistic. But same will be will be with jungle now. Maybe that also is intended when you think about it.

Also: it will be much harder to start a camp. Clothes are not quick to get and without perfect spots on edges and without nice jungles new cilizations will be quickly burning wood and food.

#8 Re: Fan Art » Fan Art: by Sandara » 2019-02-06 15:14:41

Wow, only now I noticed that circles in background schematics create halos around heads making the whole art resemble madonna with child painting.

#9 Re: Main Forum » Tarr's breeding machines » 2019-01-29 11:58:43

Let's face it: it was always griefing. Someone was born into nice place when they wanted to play? Nope. In some ways it's even worse than straight murdering them.

#10 Re: Main Forum » Tarr's breeding machines » 2019-01-29 10:57:18

How can new players "EASILY switch servers or quit and re spawn". They usually don't fiddle with settings or use mod - they are new.

#11 Re: News » Update: Big Server » 2019-01-28 08:16:52

Same. Plus picking up, eating, speaking had 5-7 seconds delayed. Literally impossible to play.

#12 Re: Main Forum » New Players Bad for Villages? » 2019-01-27 06:49:16

Yes, this happens and is not intentional I believe. That's why I sometimes add line "don't starve" in a situation where they might miss it e.g. waiting for something in a desert with hands full, focused on learning. When they realize they are about to to die they might panic. I might even feed them just in case sometimes.

Recall yourself day one - it happened, didn't it? big_smile

#13 Re: Main Forum » Donkey Town Apocalypse? » 2019-01-26 21:03:19

I had the impression that at similar time players are sent to the same distant, initially empty location (update gif, some parts from Jason, emmm... "Town"?)

#14 Re: Main Forum » Donkey Town Apocalypse? » 2019-01-26 13:14:21

Ok, so I guess that old post by Jason is no longer completely applicable.
Still, that would be nasty workaround wink

#15 Main Forum » Donkey Town Apocalypse? » 2019-01-26 12:06:14

Alias
Replies: 5

Is it possible for a few or even one player to gain enough curses so they will have enough time in Donkey Town to build whole tower virtually undisturbed by other players, because they spawn so far away from others?

Is there respawn mechanic in DT to prevent this?

#16 Re: News » Update: Big Server » 2019-01-26 08:16:28

50% virtualization overhead on CPU usage? Even when usage within your VM is below 1%??
Jason, something's seriously wrong on the Linode's part and it would be good to ask them for details where  this monster overhead comes from. I have never seen anything like this while managing VMware virtualization. Sure, intensive disk usage or even network (even memory) creates CPU overhead, but if your case was anywhere near "normal", virtualization would never be such a great tech.

Those stats show most certainly problem on their part and they should be more eager to work on their side instead of throwing it on you. I don't want to jump to any conclusions but it would be embarrassing to show clients that their 1% CPU usage in VM generates 50% usage by hypervisor - without any cause presented.

I suppose warning emails are courtesy on their part not to to cut you down to contract quotas immediately, right? Because you can set quotas, limits etc to ensure noone gets to little or too much.

There are so many things that can be wrong here. But one thing good for single thread application (when it runs efficiently) is that it's single core VM can be more easily squized into hosts CPU, while e.g. 4 vCPU VM needs to wait for 4 cores available - when there is resource contention between VMs. While going from 1 to 2 cores might be not big change in this, now your VM would be subject to (in VMware terms at least) CPU co-stop - situation when one vCPU is ready to go, but another is pending resources from the host. You don't want to do that on single thread application. Even when one vCPU does heavy lifting, both need to be scheduled on physical cores for VM to run.
That's why increasing vCPU count on VMs that don't efficiently use it usually, counterintuitively, decreases performance, if there is any contention for resources between VM (and there always is unless someone pays extra wink)

Sure, they use different technology, so I don't claim it's all applicable. But from both business and virtualization tech perspective this amount of resource waste/overhead doesn't seem viable.

#17 Re: Main Forum » Tarr's apocalyptic adventure. » 2019-01-25 12:12:33

Now that's an idea! Voluntary sacrifice and no medical workaround!

#18 Re: Main Forum » Tarr's apocalyptic adventure. » 2019-01-25 08:11:29

You would have accomplished if it stayed you Vs 50+ players server, wouldn't you? Only moving all players to one server stopped you. That's not enough? You almost did it.

From what you say if there were 2 more players similar to you cooperating with you then you would manage. 3 players Vs ALL other players to accomplish this is way to easy.

And yes, I think it is in the spirit of the thing to require at least small (5-10 players?) organized *civilization* to trigger the most challenging thing in the game - civilization wipe. I think that might be still  too easy, maybe not. Do you think, in the spirit of this game of civilization building, this should require anything less?

Don't get me wrong, it would be awesome to be part of it smile and 3 players cooperation seems like huge boost thanks to backup plans and shenanigans with meds.

#19 Re: Main Forum » Tarr's apocalyptic adventure. » 2019-01-25 06:42:21

Tarr, so you want changes to Apocalypse so it is doable by one person? Are you serious?

#20 Re: Main Forum » What to do when you run out of girls » 2019-01-24 14:57:27

When I realize the place will die out (no girls) I switch 100% to teaching mode - or learning if there is opportunity. I ask if someone wants to learn this or that or whatever they choose.
If this happened with someone building the radio then I would ask them to teach me.

#21 Re: Main Forum » To my student. » 2019-01-23 21:14:09

This. This is not a game of optimizing getting to top of tech tree. It's not even game of passing on best tools for future generation. It's a game of passing on knowledge and experience through in game interaction with other players!
This simple thing brings heavier punch that in fact meaningless saving universe or slaying a dragon in other games. Because teaching another character in this game transcends the game and means teaching another living human being and enabling them to carry on when you cannot go on.

#22 Re: Main Forum » New Players Bad for Villages? » 2019-01-23 21:03:20

Jadelink wrote:

Every time you kill a newbie rather than teach them, you doom a dozen eve camps.

Not sure if its to this extend, but i agree in principle. Neglecting or even worse, killing new players is terrible for at least two reasons:

1. This game is dead without new players. It's like abandoning kids in real life because they are useless at star, soak up resources and attention of adults. Such a short-sighted approach. New players will quit if treated that way.  New player is annoyance because you cannot finish engine or bring cow? What's the difference? Even if this helps your village in a meaningful way this place will be dead in a day or two anyway. Knowledge you pass on will endure server wipe.

2. This is sooo against the idea of the game - building civilization for another generation, not just for yourself. And for me the most memorable and impactful moments in this game come from interaction with other players, usually when I am teaching or was taught.

Though experiment: if all experienced players for a week spent 80% of their time teaching new players, what would be the result? What would be the worst? What would be the best?
Chaos, towns in ruin or abandoned? We sort of have that now. A bit bigger player base with considerably higher average skill level? Yes please. They will be more likely to stay in Eve camp, be useful in town, less likely to grief and more likely to just be in the game.

#23 Re: Main Forum » Pip Efficiency Pt.2 » 2019-01-19 21:51:39

DestinyCall wrote:

I have yet to find a situation where potential waste is the MOST important difference between two related foods, because there are always more important differences that end up mattering a lot more.   In fact, most of the time it doesn't matter at all.

My point from the start. Didn't expect that original thread - "advantage" of fewer pips food - would generate such debate and 3 more threads. And it all started with someone defending potatoes: that one of its advantages is that their bite gives only 6 pips so less waste smile I'm totally on the same page as Booklat1, betame, DestinyCall on all their points. After all it turned out its just very vocal one-man-minority with totally different understanding.
The only reason I kept posted is not to convince Crumpaloo any more, but for others reading it. So they have full info to decide what is correct and not to leave false impression that his many long posts make him right.

But by now looks like it has been done, all useful info has been salvaged and continuing will leave us with only toxic waste.

#24 Re: Main Forum » Pip Efficiency Pt.2 » 2019-01-18 22:11:02

Crumpaloo wrote:
Alias wrote:
Booklat1 wrote:

Also, for one soil and one bowl of water you can make 48 food worth of popcorn. For 1 water you can make 160 worth of mutton pie. You have to waste more than a third of the pies for popcorn to be on their level. That's why you consider the other factors, crumpaloo, you don't just dismiss them.

Yes. But even if we stay at equal cost he provided better example than I could come up with: suddenly rabbit berry pie ended up in top tier of his list. It gives 4x18 pips. But at the exact same cost (actually a bit less effort) you can get rabbit pie (4x14) plus 6 berries (6x5). It's better on bite count, total pip value and even on his precious pip efficiency. After all this talk he put THIS in top tier.

This has nothing to do with pip efficiency which is the whole reason for this post. I acknowledge other factors so this whole counter post argument is serving to do nothing but make you look like a asshole.

Let's keep it civil ok? Yes, your list was for food including all different factors, that's why I mentioned a few. Taking all into account, how exactly did you end up with rabbit berry pie as top tier?

#25 Re: Main Forum » Pip Efficiency Pt.2 » 2019-01-18 21:46:10

Booklat1 wrote:
Alias wrote:
Crumpaloo wrote:

Sure if you wanna make a crap ton of milk and pies go ahead thats not what im arguing, my point is that you can make as much of them as you want, they are still going to be wasteful and so far apart from changing their pip values i havent seen another way to make them. Also if you make popcorn and pies at the same rate and cost its doesnt make sense to go with pies, at that point youd just be losing pips for the sake of arguing. If you wanna talk about pip efficiency thats one thing, but you gotta either bring in the rest of the variables that go along with it, or talk about that subject by itself, trying to do both at once is just counter intuitive and im pretty sure thats the main reason you've been arguing at me for so long about this, :L

Make all the popcorn you want. Milk will always give more food, no matter how "pip efficient" popcorn is. Even if you fed theoretical family of only newborns, milk will always give them more food than popcorn from the same amount of corn. And this is impossible, worst case. You can be efficient at minimizing waste, I will be efficient at maximizing actual calories intake with all waste factored in.

Also, for one soil and one bowl of water you can make 48 food worth of popcorn. For 1 water you can make 160 worth of mutton pie. You have to waste more than a third of the pies for popcorn to be on their level. That's why you consider the other factors, crumpaloo, you don't just dismiss them.

Yes. But even if we stay at equal cost he provided better example than I could come up with: suddenly rabbit berry pie ended up in top tier of his list. It gives 4x18 pips. But at the exact same cost (actually a bit less effort) you can get rabbit pie (4x14) plus 6 berries (6x5). It's better on bite count, total pip value, yum (2 different foods, 3 with bowl of berries), and even on his precious pip efficiency. After all this talk he put THIS in top tier.

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