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a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building

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#1 2020-05-26 21:13:21

Arcurus
Member
Registered: 2020-04-23
Posts: 815

Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

>The goal here is to make iron a more precious and carefully-managed resource, instead of one that is practically infinite as it is scattered randomly around a practically infinite map.  This also reduces the "wander around searching" gameplay pattern.

>This is a huge change, because iron is something like the spine of the tech tree.  Some adjustments will been needed over the next few days and weeks.

The family iron system did the opposite then intended. Instead of making iron more rare it made it more abundant, since each eve family can spawn new iron, while before even with an unlimited map there is a limited lifespan to travel to bring iron to a town.

Further the current family iron system discourages offspring villages / migration since you will only get new iron through taking over from eve families.

Also it reduces the gameplay by limiting the need for exploration and competition for new iron mines and discourages to use roads to connect the iron mines. Placing the mines on a grid further discourages exploration and road building to mines.

Without new iron through new spawned eve family mines older towns would need to get the iron from more far and far away, thereby naturally increasing the challenge over time.

Last family iron mines are kind of magic and not intuitive to handle / have a high additional complexity which only vets understand fully.


Possible solution:
- Distribute iron semi random on the map, but make it more rare before the family update (if a higher challenge is wanted).
- limit the amount of iron you can get out of a mine for mines with engines
- nerv horse wagons like being slower with loaded trailer to make it more difficult to bring iron from far.

- consider first fixing eve placement, since currently eves are spawned in exhausted areas which will be then worse if iron is also exhausted.


here on github:
https://github.com/jasonrohrer/OneLife/issues/630

Last edited by Arcurus (2020-05-26 21:13:43)

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#2 2020-05-26 22:06:36

wondible
Member
Registered: 2018-04-19
Posts: 829

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

Arcurus wrote:

- Distribute iron semi random on the map, but make it more rare before the family update (if a higher challenge is wanted).

Jason hates searching gameplay. Maybe with iron guidance stones.

Stupid idea: iron deposits on grid, not linked to wells. Everybody can get a little iron; only whites can mine deeper; scatter mining expert stones throughout badlands.

More seriously, Jason wants problems, not solutions. If you want to pursue this, focus on the "Iron is too abundant" part.

My experience is that towns have some iron, sometimes little. Mostly there is enough, rarely hard out, and I wouldn't know what to do if we were out and needed some, short of go look for dead towns to loot.


https://onemap.wondible.com/ -- https://wondible.com/ohol-family-trees/ -- https://wondible.com/ohol-name-picker/
Custom client with  autorun, name completion, emotion keys, interaction keys, location slips, object search, camera pan, and more

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#3 2020-05-26 22:46:17

DestinyCall
Member
Registered: 2018-12-08
Posts: 4,130

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

wondible wrote:

Jason hates searching gameplay. Maybe with iron guidance stones.

I am imagining a waystone that points you to the nearest iron mine.    And then another waystone to help you find the iron finder waystone, since they can be a little rare.   And a third waystone to point you to the iron-finder-finding waystone.  And so on ...

Then it gets too crowded with waystones everywhere, so everything just gets moved onto a grid, with iron, water and oil all in one line.  Problem solved.

Such elegant game design.   I can see it now.

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#4 2020-05-26 22:59:10

testo
Member
Registered: 2019-05-12
Posts: 696

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

I strongly disagree with this:

"The family iron system did the opposite then intended. Instead of making iron more rare it made it more abundant, since each eve family can spawn new iron, while before even with an unlimited map there is a limited lifespan to travel to bring iron to a town."

As someone that regularly has to take the smith function when nobody else wants I can say that iron is not more abundant. The main reason you see no iron shortage is because "someone" is taking all his gameplay time to loot dead cities and move old iron to the new settlements. There is little iron left at dead cities. While some veins still have iron left there is no way you can tell iron is more abundant. Consider that every dead town that reached newcomen tech left behind a 200x200 square with no more iron that its own veins if any, because there is no untap from newcomen/diesel tech.


- I believe the term "Berrymuncher" is derogatory and therefore I shall use the term "Berrier" instead.

- Jack Ass

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#5 2020-05-26 23:06:11

Twisted
Member
Registered: 2018-10-12
Posts: 656

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

I agree 100% with testo, iron is much more rare than it used to be. Not only is it more rare in its raw form, but many iron items that used to be common are rarely seen these days. Only some doors have springs whereas springs used to be the standard for every door, knives are not as common, blowpipes and bottle making stations are rare, and any rails you might see are much shorter than before.

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#6 2020-05-26 23:33:39

wondible
Member
Registered: 2018-04-19
Posts: 829

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

Twisted wrote:

and any rails you might see are much shorter than before.

Not for lack of trying

https://onemap.wondible.com/#x=-9997&y= … 1590463936

I can't tell where this mad railbuilder is going, but I've seen at least two of them.


https://onemap.wondible.com/ -- https://wondible.com/ohol-family-trees/ -- https://wondible.com/ohol-name-picker/
Custom client with  autorun, name completion, emotion keys, interaction keys, location slips, object search, camera pan, and more

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#7 2020-05-26 23:40:54

Twisted
Member
Registered: 2018-10-12
Posts: 656

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

wondible wrote:
Twisted wrote:

and any rails you might see are much shorter than before.

Not for lack of trying

https://onemap.wondible.com/#x=-9997&y= … 1590463936

I can't tell where this mad railbuilder is going, but I've seen at least two of them.


Oh wow that is incredible

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#8 2020-05-27 07:35:46

pein
Member
Registered: 2018-03-31
Posts: 4,287

Re: Fixing the unlimited iron through family mines

I wouldn't say rarer, I would say it's grouped

since I don't play much, but when I do then a few hours, I saw towns I can't get back to in the next day
the ginger town I saw had 2-3 mines, an everything 80 NS direction had 2-3 mines possibly

the brown town I had y fence project, had shittons of iron, someone even made like a triple railroad from it

I just really preferred the randomness on it, and exploration was more rewarding, now is generic grid based poop ad you got to stick with noob eve camps for wells and iron


https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=7986 livestock pens 4.0
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=4411 maxi guide

Playing OHOL optimally is like cosplaying a cactus: stand still and don't waste the water.

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