Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

DarkDrak · 2019-08-05 19:30:35

RedComb, you're right. This shitshow is brought forward by the inability of telling who's who and who did what, thus everyone's pointing fingers.

Dodge, demn man. I made wrong assumption You gotta give a zoom out mod a try though. I promise its a huge change in the quality of experience.

Dodge · 2019-08-05 19:35:16

DarkDrak wrote:

RedComb, you're right. This shitshow is brought forward by the inability of telling who's who and who did what, thus everyone's pointing fingers.

Dodge, demn man. I made wrong assumption You gotta give a zoom out mod a try though. I promise its a huge change in the quality of experience.

I already tried it, it felt detached from the game, like a god point of view instead of a players point of view, i dont like it.

RedComb · 2019-08-05 19:44:28

Dodge wrote:

So in that other game, you're also born as a baby to a mother in a family? you also have a life that can only last an hour before being born as another baby? Can you build a full civilisation with the help of other players? etc.

No. And I never said as much.

Here is what I said: "Having played both, I can tell you it is a fair comparison because both games are a simulation of sorts and both games are sandboxes."

Also, I'm amazed you refer to UO as "that other game."

It was the first massively successful MMO. It pioneered the genre and most of what you and many younger gamers take for granted in the online games and live services space.

To refer to it as "that other game" like it is some nothing title is like somebody who plays an indie FPS game calling DOOM "that other game," or an indie RTS gamer referring to Age of Empires as "that other game."

https://www.gdcvault.com/play/1016629/C … tem-Ultima

https://www.gdcvault.com/play/1024930/C … ima-Online

UO was infinitely more influential and many times better than OHOL will EVER be. Period.

That's my point there not only does it look very different it also plays different, so even if they have some concepts in common they are completely different in their approach.

The fact that they look and play differently does not mean you can't compare them based on some of their broader similarities.

They share a lot in common and the fact that you don't know much about UO means you aren't well qualified to say whether the comparison is fair or not.

They both are sandboxes, are both multiplayer games with FFA full loot PvP, both feature a persistent world with dropable items, both feature robust crafting systems where most of the meaningful items are crafted by players, they both feature player built settlements and communities, the main content in both is not themepark questing or killing mobs but rather interacting with the environment and other players.

It's erroneous to conclude they can't be compared based on aesthetics, or single details like being born a baby to a mother, or a time limit on your lifespan, or the extent that you build civilization.

Even though they are vastly different games, I can compare aspects of EvE Online with other sandboxes like Legends of Aria. One is a spaceship game, the other an isometric fantasy based setting, but both share some core features and therefore some of the design challenges will be the same in both despite their stark differences.

It's the same with Chess and GO. Both look different, both have different rules about how pieces move, but at their core they are both games of strategy played on a board where pieces are used to capture territory and/or other pieces. I can compare aspects of both games despite their major differences.

"And when you say things like if players are powerless then give them power, don't you get that the griefers get that power too? Whatever content Jason adds for players to fight back, the griefers can use as well..."
That's where you're wrong, maybe for individual griefers that's true but not as a group, OHOL is a community/cooperation game, you are born in a family and not as an isolated individual, if you have one griefer born in a family but everyone else is "good" and they have the right tools to deal with it, then they have the advantage of number and the griefer is alone.
If you give power to groups only like families then it becomes useless for the individual and it's pretty easy to make it impossible for griefers to be in group or to be more precise in the same family.
So if they are isolated they eventually become powerless or at least on par with other isolated individuals.

Nothing prevents that isolated griefer from using coordinates and joining up with their group of friends who all grief together, therefore becoming a cooperative group of griefers who can now use the same tools against other groups or isolated non-griefing players.

Especially with the way the rift has condensed settlements and people can use mods and discord to meet up in a relatively short time span, very little stops griefers working together from destroying whole villages.

While many born in a village will just be random players, not in discord or explicitly banding together, a small group of griefers (like complained about in this thread and others) whose sole mission it is to grief will bring havoc to non-griefing players and groups.

Every tool Jason adds to the game is just another thing griefers can use against non-griefing players. Just look at property fences, for example.

People still persist in saying "have you tried using fences?" and don't grasp how gates can be blocked, or fences can be used to trap people or wall off vital resources.

Yes there are ways around this, but honestly look at the recent threads and complaints about the rift and you will see that an organized group of griefers cooperating can make the game so unfun that people stop playing before they manage to thwart these kinds of griefing attempts (and then, their depature tips the scales even more in favor of that group of griefers).

Just look at the many veteran players who stopped playing and have said griefing is way out of hand. As more and more of them quit, it leaves less and less "non-griefing" players to cooperate and stand up against organized groups that will do whatever the fuck they want to do as Gitgood puts it....

If it was an ecosystem, imagine it is a herd of pack animals being preyed upon by wolves. Yes, if the whole pack sticks together and fights, the predators will be thwarted, but they naturally space out, they run, they get isolated (and some just move on to someplace with less predators). This means the pack animals left are fewer in number and more vulnerable to the wolves and the process just repeats over and over again until the game is almost all wolves and just a scant few pack animals left.

Last edited by RedComb (2019-08-05 19:53:56)

Peremptive · 2019-08-05 23:48:16

How does being an Eve help with killing people? I am so confused. How does pvp work these days?

Villas · 2019-08-06 00:54:33

Party mode players are worse than griefers.
They make a fenced place and steal all goods from all towns and put inside, then they give access to their friends, so the gate never breaks. Also, they starve all kids inside, only their folks can play inside.

“Have you ever tried fences?”

Yes, but they born inside the fences, grow ‘till thirteen, steal the hRose alongside with swords, iron, tools, then they run to their fenced place where their party mode friends are, gain access to their gate and lock things inside.

I remember Jason didn’t want friends to be born to the same mother, because it’s strange when your mother or your uncle is your room mate, then Jason opted for twins. But now, four, five, six people can be found each other and play in party mode, even if they are mother-son or from different families, they can even send someone to donkey town each two hours if they want to.

Of course not all party mode players are bad, but most of them are. Last arc, I followed my own daughter when she took a horse and put two sworded bps and two baskets of steel, she went till the southern rift, waited in front of a gate until a guy from another family gave her access, there were more than ten horses inside, a lot of bows, arrows, swords, mountains of steel.
I went to the gate, asked her to let me in, she opened and stabbed me and then a guy from another family shot me as well, probably to steal my stuff. I thought about cursing her, but what if she curses me then and ask her friends to curse me when they born in my family?

They are worse than griefers, because they born as our kids and steal without us noticing that.

We born inside a town, we didn’t build that town, if it has one gate, what can we do, communication doesn’t work, jobs don’t last long, if we lock engines we might get cursed, killed, we can’t do everything and people don’t understand what we are doing, in the meantime party players keep stealing stuff to bring to some other town.

miskas · 2019-08-06 10:53:37

A Methodology to solve the problem
Find the measurable differences that a griefer player has to a caregiver player.
Then add futures based on those differences to balance the game effectively affecting only the griefers.

I ask for Brainstorming here / any data as well would help

I don't have data but:

-I would be somewhat sure that griefers have lower fitness score that the average player.

-They would probably have been cursed more as well

Balancing based on differences

-implement miss chance based on score.
-if you miss you still get slowed and your weapon on cooldown.

analyzing leaderboards score I observed ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ … sp=sharing )
average score ~20-22 (depending on days)
min of the top 10% : 39
min of the top 20% : 34
min of the top 30% : 30
Max of botom 20% : 8.6

distributing the miss chance exponentially from the average score (20 score) to the lowest (0 score) and giving 0% miss chance to the top 10% (39 score) would be like this:

x-axis =score
Y-axis = miss chance
https://www.desmos.com/calculator/a4k5vrog38

Possible Effects
-Griefer would not be able to kill if he keeps ruining the lives of his genes
-Anyone would think twice before being aggressive and prefer communication instead
-Killing will happen only for survival and not for entertainment
-If you want to be sure you want to kill someone you better tell the village about him to help you.

Last edited by miskas (2019-08-06 11:04:56)

JonySky · 2019-08-06 11:43:27

miskas wrote:

-I would be somewhat sure that griefers have lower fitness score that the average player.

Yesterday I spent 25 years locking up my family to starve to death and earned genetic points ...
In another life I raised wild pigs and the same thing happened ...

curiously one of the lives where I was a good mother and I took good care of my children, I lost points because my children did not know how to do anything without starving first ...

Luck!

miskas · 2019-08-06 15:46:26

Whats is your score right now or on average?

If you are a griefer I am not supposed to trust you but yes we need measurable data that could separate the griefers from the caregivers.

Also maybe you are not so much of a killer but more of a long term sabotager and as you said you don't grief all the time.

Last edited by miskas (2019-08-06 15:49:10)

JonySky · 2019-08-06 16:37:28

29.0000 or so (I don't have the computer right now)

You shouldn't trust me, or anyone else on the Internet! hehehe, but I have no reason to lie to you with this

You can check what I am telling you ... try to lock your city and not let them out of there ... and look at your punctuation
if you have a normal life (without killing anyone) your score will increase

Now try to take care of all your children and look at their score ... if you have bad luck that your children do not know how to put a berrie in their mouth ... their score will drop

I'm not a griefer ... I locked up my city for a reason ...
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=7579

Would I do it again? YES!!
but this is not my usual way of playing

Last edited by JonySky (2019-08-06 16:38:18)

ollj · 2019-08-06 16:56:35

that sw camp founded and maintained my discord suckers for way too long, who kept terrorizing the town that was closest to map center.
i turned all round stones inside SW camp into sharp stones, good luck maintaining that shitty fenche.
also, 2 bear caves inside of it got their bears awoken.

ollj · 2019-08-06 18:46:15

that sw camp founded and maintained my discord suckers for way too long, who kept terrorizing the town that was closest to map center.
i turned all round stones inside SW camp into sharp stones, good luck maintaining that shitty fenche.
also, 2 bear caves inside of it got their bears awoken.

Ilka · 2019-08-06 19:36:18

miskas wrote:

A Methodology to solve the problem
Find the measurable differences that a griefer player has to a caregiver player.
Then add futures based on those differences to balance the game effectively affecting only the griefers.
I ask for Brainstorming here / any data as well would help
I don't have data but:
-I would be somewhat sure that griefers have lower fitness score that the average player.
-They would probably have been cursed more as well
Balancing based on differences
-implement miss chance based on score.
-if you miss you still get slowed and your weapon on cooldown.

analyzing leaderboards score I observed ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ … sp=sharing )
average score ~20-22 (depending on days)
min of the top 10% : 39
min of the top 20% : 34
min of the top 30% : 30
Max of botom 20% : 8.6

distributing the miss chance exponentially from the average score (20 score) to the lowest (0 score) and giving 0% miss chance to the top 10% (39 score) would be like this:
x-axis =score
Y-axis = miss chance
https://www.desmos.com/calculator/a4k5vrog38
Possible Effects
-Griefer would not be able to kill if he keeps ruining the lives of his genes
-Anyone would think twice before being aggressive and prefer communication instead
-Killing will happen only for survival and not for entertainment
-If you want to be sure you want to kill someone you better tell the village about him to help you.

I think the average score in the long run can tell who is griefer.

In the short term, killing your family has a fatal impact on the result.

ollj · 2019-08-06 22:53:54

good thing there only need to be one person to lure 10 bears to sw corner to clear that nest of dumdum. they relocated to south-center-ish.
no. the memerscore almost only depends on your offspring and relatives, and as such it is absolutrely random.

unless you aim for a low memerscore intentionally, which is doable by intentionally killing most of your babies.

Last edited by ollj (2019-08-06 22:55:25)

Villas · 2019-08-07 01:17:14

miskas wrote:

A Methodology to solve the problem
Find the measurable differences that a griefer player has to a caregiver player.
Then add futures based on those differences to balance the game effectively affecting only the griefers.
I ask for Brainstorming here / any data as well would help
I don't have data but:
-I would be somewhat sure that griefers have lower fitness score that the average player.
-They would probably have been cursed more as well
Balancing based on differences
-implement miss chance based on score.
-if you miss you still get slowed and your weapon on cooldown.

analyzing leaderboards score I observed ( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ … sp=sharing )
average score ~20-22 (depending on days)
min of the top 10% : 39
min of the top 20% : 34
min of the top 30% : 30
Max of botom 20% : 8.6

distributing the miss chance exponentially from the average score (20 score) to the lowest (0 score) and giving 0% miss chance to the top 10% (39 score) would be like this:
x-axis =score
Y-axis = miss chance
https://www.desmos.com/calculator/a4k5vrog38
Possible Effects
-Griefer would not be able to kill if he keeps ruining the lives of his genes
-Anyone would think twice before being aggressive and prefer communication instead
-Killing will happen only for survival and not for entertainment
-If you want to be sure you want to kill someone you better tell the village about him to help you.

I don’t think basing in score right now is good, it’s an unfair system.
I’ve been abandoned more than times than I can count last week, more than 30 for sure, principally when I’m born from an Eve or someone making big roads, they simply don’t care about babies.

If I play few times a week, 5 or 7 times, my score will increas for sure. But generally I live 20-30 lives, what means I get area banned from good places in first lives and then it’s pure abandonment garbage, I’ve already been abandoned 7 times in a row until I became an Eve and couldn’t find a place to raise my babies.

What I think would be a good idea are armors, so when we are wearing an armor we have some chances of avoiding shots and stabbings.

Welp, I don’t think the current score system is fair, unless you play few lives a day.

One Hour One Life Forums

#51 2019-08-05 19:30:35

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#52 2019-08-05 19:35:16

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#53 2019-08-05 19:44:28

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#54 2019-08-05 23:48:16

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#55 2019-08-06 00:54:33

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#56 2019-08-06 10:53:37

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#57 2019-08-06 11:43:27

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#58 2019-08-06 15:46:26

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#59 2019-08-06 16:37:28

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#60 2019-08-06 16:56:35

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#61 2019-08-06 18:46:15

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#62 2019-08-06 19:36:18

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

#63 2019-08-06 22:53:54

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#64 2019-08-07 01:17:14

Re: Discord - The breeding grounds Of Griefing

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