Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

Spoonwood · 2019-06-03 23:44:50

I read this suggestion:

https://www.reddit.com/r/onehouronelife … se_rework/

and this comment:

"I think people should have a kill counter that goes down over time, and if they kill too much people they are only born to families who also have a high kill counter. Agressive genes, and all that.

So put all the stab-happy people together, and let other people know who the stab-happy families are, then if you want war you can actually identify the violent and ignorant families from the peaceful and nice ones."

by /u/Saeras9 here: https://www.reddit.com/r/onehouronelife … er_a_joke/

The core issue is lack of player accountability. Maybe there's more player accountability if the apple would stay closer to the tree in terms of the apple and the tree's violence level per number of lives lived?

Maybe that's not the problem though.

Maybe it's lack of karma.

Oh wait... I'm not supposed to have the ability to derive problems from suggestions. But the memory hole is full I tell you!

futurebird · 2019-06-03 23:50:41

It's a really fun idea. And I it would give the people who kill a lot the challenge they deserve (want?)

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-03 23:58:42

But what if the griefers team up to terrorise nice families?

Currently it's hard for them to do so on purpose without using the twin triplet quadruplet system

I know griefers and team up doesn't sound like they go together but what if?

futurebird · 2019-06-04 00:04:12

RodneyC86 wrote:

But what if the griefers team up to terrorise nice families?
Currently it's hard for them to do so on purpose without using the twin triplet quadruplet system
I know griefers and team up doesn't sound like they go together but what if?

Somehow I don't think they will be that great at co-operating. And only a small handful of griefers are really into the the game enough to know it super well.

I think the effects of this would be more subtile.

Also some people who kill a lot aren't greifers. They are the people who kill griefers right away. So, they would be there too...

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 00:09:38

futurebird wrote:

RodneyC86 wrote:
But what if the griefers team up to terrorise nice families?
Currently it's hard for them to do so on purpose without using the twin triplet quadruplet system
I know griefers and team up doesn't sound like they go together but what if?
Somehow I don't think they will be that great at co-operating. And only a small handful of griefers are really into the the game enough to know it super well.
I think the effects of this would be more subtile.
Also some people who kill a lot aren't greifers. They are the people who kill griefers right away. So, they would be there too...

Yeah this could be a problem. So it deincentifies heroes from doing their job for fear of landing deeper into villain territory, and the deeper they go into violent cities, the more they have to kill. It's gritty and all and has a mad Max / borderlands vibe but I ferlar heroes won't appreciate it.

Maybe a bounty system? But hidden? Killing a player with high historical kill score will count far less to your kill score? Killing a meek player will give you big kill score

futurebird · 2019-06-04 01:11:55

If you kill someone who two other people curse it shouldn't count.

pein · 2019-06-04 01:44:12

right now doeosnt matter
any stab happy noob can kill the best duelists out there, and you pacifist would end up in shit looking cities
there is a correlation you forget, with the highest percentage of kills recorded i also had the longest linages generally

i would say get good , but that doesn't apply anymore
there is no skill gap
stand on pads and fence yourself
or kill everyone with a weapon

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 02:29:49

pein wrote:

right now doeosnt matter
any stab happy noob can kill the best duelists out there, and you pacifist would end up in shit looking cities
there is a correlation you forget, with the highest percentage of kills recorded i also had the longest linages generally
i would say get good , but that doesn't apply anymore
there is no skill gap
stand on pads and fence yourself
or kill everyone with a weapon

I can respect that Jason doesn't want skill based combat on the game. Sorry for your loss pein

I do agree players who are willing to stand up and fight are a great asset to a town. I have great respect for players who are good at singling out trolls, I myself would likely be fooled by a troll to kill an innocent so I tend to lock myself out from the action best I can.

That's why I don't think heroes should be penalised for taking out troublemakers. Just not sure a way

Spoonwood · 2019-06-04 02:39:46

pein wrote:

right now doeosnt matter
any stab happy noob can kill the best duelists out there, and you pacifist would end up in shit looking cities
there is a correlation you forget, with the highest percentage of kills recorded i also had the longest linages generally

Pein you've said before that you weren't into the Eve game. So, that's not you as Eve in this case. You did NOT have a good amount of children who became grandchildren on average in the thread a while back where that got recorded as I recall. I call complete bs on this one.

Also, killing has a slow down period where you can't pick up babies. Can't drop the weapon until swords until the cooldown is down as I recall. Killing people in general is not proper parenting procedure. You can't feed a child, because you killed someone? That's simply not good parenting procedure.

pein wrote:

i would say get good , but that doesn't apply anymore

You're very knowledgeable Pein in terms of game mechanics. You can dance circles around most pen makers I'm sure. You can organize berry farms well and helped to originate the concept. I'm sure I'd personally enjoy playing with you. But, that doesn't make you knowledgeable about good parenting. Seriously Pein, you're tempted to play the 'get good' card? Well, then I feel tempted to tell you to get good at parenting, and by that I mean motherhood in the game.

Last edited by Spoonwood (2019-06-04 02:40:26)

Spoonwood · 2019-06-04 02:43:10

RodneyC86 wrote:

I have great respect for players who are good at singling out trolls, I myself would likely be fooled by a troll to kill an innocent so I tend to lock myself out from the action best I can.

How many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horsecart or try to escape the public view in general?

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 03:24:23

Spoonwood wrote:

RodneyC86 wrote:

I have great respect for players who are good at singling out trolls, I myself would likely be fooled by a troll to kill an innocent so I tend to lock myself out from the action best I can.
How many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horsecart or try to escape the public view in general?

Errr what? I don't see how this is related but I don't know, you tell me how many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horse cart or try to escape the public view in general.

futurebird · 2019-06-04 03:53:15

Spoonwood wants women to stay in the kitchen making pies. LOL.

Spoonwood · 2019-06-04 04:31:48

futurebird wrote:

Spoonwood wants women to stay in the kitchen making pies. LOL.

Kitchens usually have knives, including in OHOL. Why would you consequently say that I want this?

Spoonwood · 2019-06-04 04:33:00

RodneyC86 wrote:

Spoonwood wrote:
RodneyC86 wrote:

I have great respect for players who are good at singling out trolls, I myself would likely be fooled by a troll to kill an innocent so I tend to lock myself out from the action best I can.
How many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horsecart or try to escape the public view in general?
Errr what? I don't see how this is related but I don't know, you tell me how many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horse cart or try to escape the public view in general.

I don't know. I would expect it's zero or so low it may as well be zero.

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 04:38:04

Spoonwood wrote:

RodneyC86 wrote:
Spoonwood wrote:
How many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horsecart or try to escape the public view in general?
Errr what? I don't see how this is related but I don't know, you tell me how many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horse cart or try to escape the public view in general.
I don't know. I would expect it's zero or so low it may as well be zero.

I would think so too but why do you ask?
When I meant I lock myself out I mean as far as I can reasonably do so. Obviously if I'm a fertile woman I have to spend time near the nursery. But I otherwise mostly work at town outskirts or foraging.

futurebird · 2019-06-04 04:45:03

You don't have to spend time near the nursery. You can raise a kid anywhere. In some ways raising kids while out rabbit hunting is great since you can clothe them as they are born and then bring them back to town dressed.

If you have a horse you can move with the kid back to town with the horse if it isn't far. Not ideal, but there is no reason to avoid things like getting wood by horse just because you might have a kid. Iron is another issue.

As for killing players? I don't even get that. Are you saying you want people to kill players for not being "good" parents? Is that it? How would killing such a person help anything?

Really though I hate standing by a fire and will always raise the kid while doing something if it's possible. And I don't really like being left by the fire either, but I get why people do it.

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 04:52:48

futurebird wrote:

You don't have to spend time near the nursery. You can raise a kid anywhere. In some ways raising kids while out rabbit hunting is great since you can clothe them as they are born and then bring them back to town dressed.
If you have a horse you can move with the kid back to town with the horse if it isn't far. Not ideal, but there is no reason to avoid things like getting wood by horse just because you might have a kid. Iron is another issue.
As for killing players? I don't even get that. Are you saying you want people to kill players for not being "good" parents? Is that it? How would killing such a person help anything?
Really though I hate standing by a fire and will always raise the kid while doing something if it's possible. And I don't really like being left by the fire either, but I get why people do it.

Wait who said anything about stabbing people not being good parents? Many peeps I understand can be absorbed into projects and will dump babies at nurseries for the nursemaid to care for them. That's fine, as long as you ask the nursemaid . Personally, I don't even mind, if you can bother to pick me up and drop menl at a nice place , Im contented

I was talking about full blown griefers

Yeah I still get some farming and lumbering done while raising a kid but admittedly it's annoying and exhausting. And I think some kids actually get pissed when I'm not there for them 24/7??? I had a kid tell me I don't love him because I left them to a nursemaid initially.

Spoonwood · 2019-06-04 04:53:23

RodneyC86 wrote:

Spoonwood wrote:
RodneyC86 wrote:
Errr what? I don't see how this is related but I don't know, you tell me how many players signal out fertile women who leave town on a horse cart or try to escape the public view in general.
I don't know. I would expect it's zero or so low it may as well be zero.
I would think so too but why do you ask?
When I meant I lock myself out I mean as far as I can reasonably do so. Obviously if I'm a fertile woman I have to spend time near the nursery. But I otherwise mostly work at town outskirts or foraging.

You said

RodneyC86 wrote:

I have great respect for players who are good at singling out trolls ...

The core concept of the game is that you care for your offspring.

jasonrohrer wrote:

The core idea in this game is that you care for your offspring because they are the future that gives what you accomplish in the game meaning.

Fertile women leaving town on a horsecart aren't likely to care for their offspring. So, they aren't likely to take the core concept seriously. Thus, they are likely trolling the game in the respect that they aren't taking that core concept seriously in terms of their play choices. In other words, they are trolls ... with respect to Jason's core concept for the game. Given that no one is singling these females out, and such players troll the very core concept of the game, no one is all that good at singling out trolls in the game.

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 04:56:31

Spoonwood wrote:

RodneyC86 wrote:
Spoonwood wrote:
I don't know. I would expect it's zero or so low it may as well be zero.
I would think so too but why do you ask?
When I meant I lock myself out I mean as far as I can reasonably do so. Obviously if I'm a fertile woman I have to spend time near the nursery. But I otherwise mostly work at town outskirts or foraging.
You said
RodneyC86 wrote:
I have great respect for players who are good at singling out trolls ...
The core concept of the game is that you care for your offspring.
jasonrohrer wrote:
The core idea in this game is that you care for your offspring because they are the future that gives what you accomplish in the game meaning.
Fertile women leaving town on a horsecart aren't likely to care for their offspring. So, they aren't likely to take the core concept seriously. Thus, they are likely trolling the game in the respect that they aren't taking that core concept seriously in terms of their play choices. In other words, they are trolls ... with respect to Jason's core concept for the game. Given that no one is singling these females out, and such players troll the very core concept of the game, no one is all that good at singling out trolls in the game.

Core concept being key. Note the word core. It is not the only thing in the game.

So you are proposing women who leave on horsecarts automatically get the stab?

futurebird · 2019-06-04 04:58:44

RodneyC86 wrote:

Wait who said anything about stabbing people not being good parents?

Spoonwood did. He seems to think the fact that people don't get angry at what he defines as "bad moms" means that people aren't "taking the game seriously" or some nonsense. I hardly can make sense of it myself since his whole premise that women using a horse or not hanging by the nursery are "bad moms" isn't even correct.

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 05:03:21

futurebird wrote:

RodneyC86 wrote:
Wait who said anything about stabbing people not being good parents?
Spoonwood did. He seems to think the fact that people don't get angry at what he defines as "bad moms" means that people aren't "taking the game seriously" or some nonsense. I hardly can make sense of it myself since his whole premise that women using a horse or not hanging by the nursery are "bad moms" isn't even correct.

Honestly, we just need woman an option to remain celibate. I really don't like this whole asexual budding going on

But then, I guess women choosing to remain celibate can be considered griefing the village, even if they go out to do a job better done when unhindered by children. What a fun world we live in.

spoonwood is right to an extent of course, for optimal fertility women should be huddling around a fire yumming. But that is....EXTREMELY BORING

futurebird · 2019-06-04 05:12:57

I'd like to look at some numbers. I feel like using yum and standing near (but not on! you have to bounce) the fire give you more kids but not as many stay. I feel like the kids I have while hunting rabbits stay most often. The kids I have while getting iron stay the least (I don't use a horse for long trips when in the fertile years)

Even kids who I have when using the hose seem to stay more than nursery kids.

Also leaving town can help you get around the area ban and you'll have kids you *can't* have in town, namely people who lived in that town for years and love it.

So, I don't know if it's that simple.

lychee · 2019-06-04 05:18:10

^^; this thread is pretty intense.

OHOL is a game; not everybody plays it to be 100% optimal/efficient, and honestly all each player is looking for is to have fun (however they find it fun).

With regards to "core concepts" of the game, Jason may have had something in mind while making the game, but that doesn't necessarily mean that players will play a game exactly the way a developer intended it (or the way experienced players think it should be played). That's natural. No developer can manipulate/force/control their players to play a certain way or feel certain emotions. However, they can design the game in ways that incentivize (or de-incentivize) certain behaviors.

In the case of OHOL, Jason can't force players to care for their offspring just by waving pretty words. That's outside of Jason's scope of power, and it's not very effective to complain that players aren't playing the game the way it was originally intended. Regardless of what philosophies or objectives or ideals we might have -- a gamer is only going to be looking to have fun.

However, how to get players to *want to care* about their offspring is another question entirely, and a much more interesting use of one's time to discuss.

Last edited by lychee (2019-06-04 05:19:41)

RodneyC86 · 2019-06-04 05:25:07

lychee wrote:

^^; this thread is pretty intense.
OHOL is a game; not everybody plays it to be 100% optimal/efficient, and honestly all each player is looking for is to have fun (however they find it fun).
With regards to "core concepts" of the game, Jason may have had something in mind while making the game, but that doesn't necessarily mean that players will play a game exactly the way a developer intended it (or the way experienced players think it should be played). That's natural. No developer can manipulate/force/control their players to play a certain way or feel certain emotions. However, they can design the game in ways that incentivize (or de-incentivize) certain behaviors.
In the case of OHOL, Jason can't force players to care for their offspring just by waving pretty words. That's outside of Jason's scope of power, and it's not very effective to complain that players aren't playing the game the way it was originally intended. Regardless of what philosophies or objectives or ideals we might have -- a gamer is only going to be looking to have fun.
However, how to get players to *want to care* about their offspring is another question entirely, and a much more interesting use of one's time to discuss.

Welp, one way is if the tech tree is so mega deep the final step takes 10000 steps to reach. Maybe a space mission to Mars. But Jason is only one poor man working on this lol

Seriously though, I think it's the futility of the end game. In life, we still don't know what's in store for our future. In OHOL, it's either

1) endlessly keeping production lines going and world turns into a fancy chatroom

2) stab-o-rama, because bored

3) the best outcome, people get creative with the game, making altars, mazes, gimmick buildings. I personally want to make an arena some day. Four competitors, slot box of four knives in the middle .guy with a straight shaft hits box, knifes fly, pick u pquickly and stab everyone. Last man standing wins. Please proceed to the east entrance to get surgical treatment. Thank youuuuu

So yeah, a bigger vertical expanding tech tree will help a lot to make people care

pein · 2019-06-04 12:27:53

you can call it bs but before jason fixed coordinate tracking, i took a random eve, and our line was top 1 that week, coming from 1500 tiles, taking over emberson camp and 60+ generations were all my descendants, Haak was the longest line, and Cucci was top 4, were i got 12 packs and 3 horses from Dante/Dupont city, ended up havign the only airplane on server

but lets just say that every long line at game start had the most buildigns and optimizations built by me, back before at the start we remembered every big town with long lineage, i forgot some but lets just say a few: West. had the pen made by me, all horse fences, cisterns, bucket station - it was the first big town after berry buffs

San-cal actually was going a while but i was there at the start and didn't really looked like anything until me and dodge cut out the jungle, locked the mosquitoes with bell tower bases and made some nice farms

Casino city: i got one of their outposts, the cow, lot of iron

Bonsai garden: the whole outpost to iron, which became main town later
ginger update

Painter town: me and mo mand daughter painted a whole building red and yellow, was 4k from Casino town

Karltown: this was looong ago, when i first met Aurora, i made the most structures there and each biome had a horse fence to it

I wasn't that much into eve play and im not the only one who plays like this, Eve west got a lot of nice spots going, Pharo, Tarr, Mirelli, even Morti
but all those places had the most functionable buildigns made by me
and you cant cal lme a bad Eve because i don't force it often, i still made pens and got mines as Eve

every noob can be eve with smart kids
i stood by newbees and they were happy seeing their town grow, was it their accomplishment? sure they had to take care of kids and don't do stupid stuff, and communicate, it's a team effort, even if you got the best locations and best players, noob kids can ruin it

and sometimes for the heck of it i was making impossible locations work, like a kiln in between trees or a town with no water just cacti farm

You overvalue kids, but by my experience, the biggest compost piles run out, the baskets break and the town goes down in flames in 9 gen, so it's not about you, you affect 4 gen directly and 9-10 by your work you leave behind

And my pareenting skills are just fine, during emergency im the one saving the crying little girls, and my kids become survivors, is very common that only my kids survive and my sisters die early and her kids cant find the nearest wild food while mines know where to run during a famine

i do have one of highest average age, even with most dangerous lifestyle and if you talk about statistic im always in top 10 furthest exploring players
ofc im not really into standing near fire when someone else does it, after so many kids , at least i pick people up and if they follow they will live, if not, well they wouldn't be useful anyway

stop taking your children's archievements as your own, it's pure luck
my daughter had twins and quads and we took over blondin city
there is no skill involved in that, you stand in fire talking so they don't suicide? sure good for stats but zero for work done

making an early pen, getting iron, keeping the town fucntional and organized, those things help player retention
and your whole yum and heat bonus worth 1 girl tops, once
having more people wont mean more work done
and having the wrong kind of people wont make a good town

i seen newbees keep up a town for 9 gen until i returned, zero work done, almost dead, ready pen, no sheep still, no soil, no one found my dead body with rope near a shot mouflon
i seen gen 62 people think it's an eve town for an outpost
i seen 11 gen srvive on wild food not making a bowl

a nicely set village with fun activities can go longer than a huge population with huge famines if they don't work their ass off

why are you so good parent? cause you roleplay a bit? idc about is my son or nepfew, if it's a good player i help him and im the first to stab my griefer daughter

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-06-03 23:44:50

Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#2 2019-06-03 23:50:41

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#3 2019-06-03 23:58:42

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#4 2019-06-04 00:04:12

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#5 2019-06-04 00:09:38

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#6 2019-06-04 01:11:55

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#7 2019-06-04 01:44:12

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#8 2019-06-04 02:29:49

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#9 2019-06-04 02:39:46

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#10 2019-06-04 02:43:10

Re: Problem: The Apple Can Fall Too Far From The Tree?

#11 2019-06-04 03:24:23

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#12 2019-06-04 03:53:15

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#13 2019-06-04 04:31:48

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#14 2019-06-04 04:33:00

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#15 2019-06-04 04:38:04

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#16 2019-06-04 04:45:03

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#17 2019-06-04 04:52:48

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#18 2019-06-04 04:53:23

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#19 2019-06-04 04:56:31

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#20 2019-06-04 04:58:44

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#21 2019-06-04 05:03:21

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#22 2019-06-04 05:12:57

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#23 2019-06-04 05:18:10

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#24 2019-06-04 05:25:07

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#25 2019-06-04 12:27:53

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