The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

CatX · 2019-02-19 15:39:58

I wish clothes were better.
Especially pelts and furs.

I'd prefer to live in a town with no buildings, they cause too much lag for me.

Spoonwood · 2019-02-19 16:02:38

CatX wrote:

I wish clothes were better.
Especially pelts and furs.
I'd prefer to live in a town with no buildings, they cause too much lag for me.

I've had a lag problem on low population servers in some spots, and come to think of it, I think it's only happened inside of buildings. That said, in Frost's town on server12 inside of his/"her" smithy I don't recall experience that sort of lag problem.

Peremptive · 2019-02-19 17:52:29

stew wrote:

Okey.. why even make rooms/walls then? Just place floor everywhere. Maybe use the stone you would have used for walls for stonefloor, that will visually separate the working areas.

Think about it this way: if you want to replace *all* walls with floors, and have the same insulated area, for each wall you would need instead a bit more than 4 floors. Here is how:
For non corner tiles, each wall would be replaced by one floor on its tile, and three more floors directly out. For each tile at the corners, you would need one floor for the actual tile, plus a 3x3 square of floors covering the corner. So the larger the room, the lower the average of floors needed per wall replaced, since there are more non corner tiles. You would also need all tiles to be free of natural obstructions so you can place the floors.

If you are only replacing part of a wall with floors, you need more floors per wall tile replaced because you have to cover the open tiles with floors at a 3 tile radius in all external directions. So you would need a 7x3 floor rectangle added outside of a single tile open entrance, plus one floor for the door tile itself, if I understand correctly. So for a single tile wide door, you exchange one wall for a whopping 22 floors. Essentially, that is one column of 3 tiles directly on front of the door, and two 3x3 floor squares to the sides: (S=stone wall, F = floor, O = open)

S.S.S.S.F.S.S.S.S
O.F.F.F.F.F.F.F.O
O.F.F.F.F.F.F.F.O
O.F.F.F.F.F.F.F.O
O.O.O.O.O.O.O

As long as you don't get within 3 tiles from a corner, making the open door two tiles wide means you need one less wall and just 4 more floors. This holds if you keep removing walls until you reach three tiles from the corner of a room. At that point you have to insulate the sides as well.

One stone usable for wall/floor requires one shovel use, and two chisel uses. Both of these break (the chisel less frequently iirc). So using stone for A log requires just one ax use, but you need four at best. So floors should be a bit more steel-intensive than stones. Then again axes seem to last more than shovels (but I am not sure about that, crazyeddie probably knows). Either way there is a lot of both of these resources, just a bit of a pain to bring them back.

Collecting logs seems a bit easier/faster. You can run out on foot with your ax once, quickly chop up many trees you don't need, and then go back and transport them with a horse cart. It is faster to fill up one cart with logs, so you won't be chasing after it that often compared to stones. With stones to really prepare so you won't be chasing your horse later, you need shovel to dig it up, then mallet and chisel, so that you can split the stone to two pieces that can be placed in the cart. All three tools might break at any time. So you would probably need one trip on foot with a shovel and a second trip on foot with another mallet which breaks more easily of the three before the horse trip. However you also need at least four times as many floor tiles as stone walls you are replacing, one cart is two stone walls or four wood floors, so you need at least double the trips for 4 times the floors.

Anyways, it feels that floors are a bit easier to make. Cutting trees also provides firewood, which you will need sooner or later. Plus having all these floored tiles outside the building area would five insulation bonuses to people working outside the building, and allow for much faster work which in itself saves food. So I suspect having one side open to keep expanding as needed will become common.

DestinyCall · 2019-02-19 20:28:15

Thank you, stew. I finally got it working! I'd tried setting up a local sever this way before, but it didn't work. I think it was because I extracted the folder into my OHOL folder under Steam instead of putting it in the Programs folder on its own. Must have prevented the .bat file from doing its thing.

Yay! I have my own little Eve camp goinf now. First step iron tool ... next step, make buildings!

pein · 2019-02-20 01:55:41

answer me this:

if we threat a player as this, with an aura, with a 8x8 box
and place it in a room
if the room is open, there is only a few tiles outside the range of door
the green border
the blue is always affected by connected tiles trough the door
the orange is sticking out of the room but is not connected trough the door
will the walls cut off the negative effect of outside tiles?
or will only calculate that the room is open and you got outside tiles in your "aura"

CrazyEddie · 2019-02-20 03:47:01

The algorithm doesn't know about the room, it only knows about the aura. Nothing outside your aura affects your heat, ever.

The aura is blocked by walls, but it leaks through open doors and gaps (including diagonal gaps!).

If the player is on the orange tiles, the aura has no way to leak through the walls. The part of the aura sticking out past the walls is not included in the player's airspace (aura is different from airspace!). The walls are also not included in the airspace! Since the airspace is completely floored, the biome's contribution (either heat or cold) will be reduced. If there are any fires within the airspace, their heat will be concentrated onto only the few tiles that are within the airspace, which includes only tiles inside the room (which means the fires are more effective).

If the player is on the blue tiles, the aura leaks through the open door. The part of the aura sticking out past the walls will be included in the airspace because it connects back to the player through the open door. Since the tiles outside the room are not floored, the airspace is not completely floored and so the biome's contribution will not be reduced. If there are any fires within the airspace, their heat will be spread out among all the tiles in the airspace, including the tiles outside the room (which means the fires are less effective).

Note that if the player is standing right in the center so that their aura doesn't touch any of the walls, then those walls do not affect their heat and effectively do not exist. That lowers the total insulation of their airspace, which means that fires won't be as effective and biome reduction won't be as effective. If the player moves one tile in any direction, their aura will touch the walls (some of the walls), and the walls they touch will now exist for them, which will increase their airspace's insulation, which will make the fires and the biome reduction more effective.

Last edited by CrazyEddie (2019-02-20 03:51:22)

CrazyEddie · 2019-02-20 04:02:55

I said this:

CrazyEddie wrote:

floors are so much more important than walls - every floor is counted four times when adding up the insulation totals, whereas each wall is counted only once. It's right there in the code: floor insulation values are quadrupled.

But I was wrong. I looked at the code more carefully and now I think I understand it better.

It's complicated to explain, but essentially walls are counted three times and floors are counted four times. So floors are more important than walls, but walls still matter.

Not having walls close to you reduces your insulation quite a bit, which in turn reduces the effectiveness of the fires and the reduces the effectiveness of the biome reduction.

Being near an open door will completely kill the biome reduction, but it only has a small effect on fires, because it only has a small effect on the insulation, because the walls (and floors) still count.

---

Spoonwood, I hope my last two posts here will help you figure out how to optimize your buildings. I myself have no idea what will work best; I've only tried to understand the algorithm.

Last edited by CrazyEddie (2019-02-20 04:05:55)

DestinyCall · 2019-02-20 05:13:44

I like the idea of constructing long rooms with two parallel walls and open ends. Easy to expand and enter/exit freely, difficult to grief. I will need to do some testing to see if it makes sense in game, but a building with long narrow open-ended rooms might end up being more practical than one big enclosed space. If you make the interior of the long room 5 tiles wide and at least 10 tiles deep, the middle space would be nice and warm. Perfect for a nursery. As your village grows, you can continue to lengthen the room and add additional fires, when necessary.

pein · 2019-02-20 11:59:00

so if you are having open doors anyway
this would be a setup where your airspace is smallest possible: 4x4 as you are on bottom right and the wall cuts off the rest
and most optimized tiles
instead of 64 uncovered tile you got 16 covered tiles
even without the room bonus heating, this should be good enough
if this doesn't give like 0.2 heat? does this whole thing matter at all?
i mean a small fire is almost perfect outside
two big fires 2 tiles away gave perfect on L shape diagonal from one of it

instead of making rooms and having open doors anyway, just floor it down or put airlocks
walls are annoying in current form, they cover, they block

isn't it enough that we make a room and heat it? that should put that few tiles on medium heat
not like you do anything else there than combine ready resources

lychee · 2019-05-11 18:16:23

Bump so I don't lose. Temperature on wiki needs updating

One Hour One Life Forums

#26 2019-02-19 15:39:58

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#27 2019-02-19 16:02:38

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#28 2019-02-19 17:52:29

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#29 2019-02-19 20:28:15

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#30 2019-02-20 01:55:41

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#31 2019-02-20 03:47:01

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#32 2019-02-20 04:02:55

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#33 2019-02-20 05:13:44

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#34 2019-02-20 11:59:00

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

#35 2019-05-11 18:16:23

Re: The New Temperature System, Explained Simply

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