Water Needs to be Reworked

UnnoticedShadow · 2018-10-28 22:47:35

Water, as one might expect, is a very important part of core game-play. It is one of the three important permanent features in a world (the other being desert/cacti) and necessary to grow EVERY food except mushrooms, meaning unless you want to live off the land you NEED to settle near a significant mass of water.

While this does not sound like a problem at first, you have to take into consideration water only generates in the swamp, and wells HAVE to be built on top of ponds. This not only drastically lowers the amount of places that are viable to settle in early on, but late game too. This can mean, even if the second generation on does NOTHING wrong, and fixes Everything that can possibly be fixed, water will either be limitlessly abundant, or a giant limiting factor.

This, however, is only discussing water itself. many water transportation/storage methods are also broken because of this, take for example water skins. As water is the MOST important natural resource that cannot be replicated, the majority of successful homes will be built around water, as opposed to other places far away from water. As if this wasn't bad enough, the water skin is outclassed by the bucket, and equally as expensive, resulting in there being ZERO use for said item. A lot of the above also applies to the Cistern, with it having a very high cost anyways. This results in the bowl and the bucket being the only viable option for water usage.

With all of these factors combined, there is not a trace of doubt that the water system needs a rework, but the question remains how?

One might say add rivers and lakes, but that is MUCH easier said than done, as I can't imagine how that would work.

Another might say to make wells build-able everywhere, but that would make the cistern even more useless, and that feature was removed for some reason. (Tell me why)

I would love to hear other ideas below, as I am still curious on how such a problem could be fixed.

Catfive · 2018-10-28 23:42:51

UnnoticedShadow wrote:

Another might say to make wells build-able everywhere, but that would make the cistern even more useless, and that feature was removed for some reason. (Tell me why)

Everywhere was covered in wells..

I would like irrigation of some sort, perhaps via cisterns to give them a use? I don't mind if it means building pipes etc too. Cisterns are actually a great thing already mind you if used correctly by filling them from wells and then letting the wells recover while you use the cisterns water stick but every new player just ignores them and empties the wells instead.

UnnoticedShadow · 2018-10-28 23:50:48

Pickaxe + Well = Shallow Well + Bucket, and Pickaxe + Shallow Well = Fraction of rocks restored (Takes 2 pickaxes to break)

Jk Howling · 2018-10-28 23:55:06

I agree that right now the amount of viable places to settle in is way too thin- especially if you factor in a desert to keep food consumption lower. The most ideal location would be a good sized desert, a decent size swamp with many ponds, and a large grassland biome within easy walking distance.

Unfortunately such a specific location is sometimes completely impossible to find within a feasible amount of time as an eve. I've had eve runs fail solely because I simply never found a good place to settle. Either there wouldn't be enough ponds, wouldn't be a desert, or wouldn't be a big enough grassland to support my family.

I do wish there were more options for water. The meta has stagnated at desert-swamp-grassland cities. You'll almost never see an established civilization that isn't within these boundaries. Meanwhile irl, there's vast amounts of different cultures in different climates, all around the world. There's variety. Different ways of life. OHOL very much lacks that.

The only idea that comes to mind for increasing the spread of water, would be putting swamp equivalents in other biomes. Freshwater springs in grasslands/savannas. Rare oases in the desert. Maybe being able to melt snow from snowbanks in a crock over the fire in the arctic.

It doesn't enable us to make wells wherever we want, as that'd be as broken as it was before, but it would give us more options in places to settle at least. We wouldn't have to look for quite such specific locations to camp on.

Carrot-Seedling · 2018-10-29 00:16:56

Catfive, there is no penalty anymore for emptying a well or a pond. Just an FYI.
But it is very annoying to have a town who can't figure out what the cistern is for, and you have to show people before they can use it right.

Booklat1 · 2018-10-29 00:19:16

While I agree with the need of more realistic water elements I disagree we need wells to be buildable anywhere. It is part of the fun that you need to stay close to water, or build cisterns if you wanna expand somewhere else. Thing is there is absolutely no reward to expand.

Want a small base near rabbits? cistern and well will do. Same for deserts. It is actually pretty easy to transport water with buckets and cart (just a bit hard to get buckets).

Nooow, if we had more permanent elements in the map and in biomes that weren't already occupied, maybe we'd need more advanced water tech.

What happens if cold biomes are needed for, like mentioned in discord yesterday, oil? What if cisterns there froze? This is just an idea, but my point is that, lke you said, water in just a part of a bigger problem refering world generation. (in this case, water and biomes being very straightforward)

Last edited by Booklat1 (2018-10-29 00:20:35)

Anshin · 2018-10-29 00:39:26

Uncle Gus had a water biome and rivers mod, so it is doable. Something like the great lakes is awesome, or you could make it an ocean where water requires desalination. It looks so good too.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=2233

The rivers could use some prettying up, but they show that irrigation and pipes should also be doable!

Jk Howling · 2018-10-29 01:17:37

Catfive wrote:

Cisterns are actually a great thing already mind you if used correctly by filling them from wells and then letting the wells recover while you use the cisterns water stick but every new player just ignores them and empties the wells instead.

Please tell me you're not one of the ancient players who constantly shout at me for emptying a well into a cistern. They regenerate on their own- even when emptied, all at the same pace. There's no downside at all to emptying a well, especially now that we have an indicator for when cisterns have water in them.

I don't know which misinformed player is worse tbh: The people who think that empty wells won't refill, or those that insist that if you don't leave a berry on the bush they won't grow back lmao. I've also heard of people who think if you leave a clay in the pit, it'll regenerate.. Same with leaving reed stumps..

None of these are true. They might've been some time ago, but currently they're not.
A lot of urban legends in the game atm it seems.

Azrael · 2018-10-29 06:11:10

Jk Howling wrote:

Catfive wrote:
Cisterns are actually a great thing already mind you if used correctly by filling them from wells and then letting the wells recover while you use the cisterns water stick but every new player just ignores them and empties the wells instead.
Please tell me you're not one of the ancient players who constantly shout at me for emptying a well into a cistern. They regenerate on their own- even when emptied, all at the same pace. There's no downside at all to emptying a well, especially now that we have an indicator for when cisterns have water in them.
I don't know which misinformed player is worse tbh: The people who think that empty wells won't refill, or those that insist that if you don't leave a berry on the bush they won't grow back lmao. I've also heard of people who think if you leave a clay in the pit, it'll regenerate.. Same with leaving reed stumps..
None of these are true. They might've been some time ago, but currently, they're not.
A lot of urban legends in the game atm it seems.

These "urban legends" come from the point in time where it WAS possible like you mentioned there indeed WAS a time where every town and city had many 'don't' rules. Don't pick non-fruiting milkweed, don't empty ponds, don't empty wells, don't pick all the berries, don't pick all carrots, leave one row for seed. All these rules were relevant. Nowadays, there are many new players and new rules but don't forget the majority of the fanbase came from back then when it WAS plausible.

I know you said that they aren't current and that people need to stop spreading rumours, I agree, however not acknowledging that at some time (months actually) there were THE OHOL rules, is kinda disrespectful. I mean who still says that? I haven't met anyone who still says these things...I kinda miss it.

tana · 2018-10-29 08:17:33

Jk Howling wrote:

Catfive wrote:
Cisterns are actually a great thing already mind you if used correctly by filling them from wells and then letting the wells recover while you use the cisterns water stick but every new player just ignores them and empties the wells instead.
Please tell me you're not one of the ancient players who constantly shout at me for emptying a well into a cistern. They regenerate on their own- even when emptied, all at the same pace. There's no downside at all to emptying a well, especially now that we have an indicator for when cisterns have water in them.

actually it's even better to empty a deep well and constantly empty it, since and dry deep well will need 30 min to regenerate one bucket, but an non empty one will need 45 min for the next charge. Granted you might get more than two buckets, but you might not. I tested once, i put 10 buckets into a dry well, and could still only retrieve one. At least cisterns are a constant number, they should be filled all the time.

pein · 2018-10-29 16:37:30

i would like cisterns to be same level as shallow well even if it holds less, maybe cost less

the bigger biome idea was popular, but we would need branches, water and milkweed in every biome
oasis would be cool as a limited resource just as mines
once you deplete an oasis it wouldn't be filled anymore, this would make any place mostly viable if you are skilled enough to build up fast
would be nice having roads to water and using cistern in a desert town

i guess wouldn't hurt the game having high refill, low max capacity wells, enforcing cisterns, makes better designs later on, also if cisterns would allow pouches and/or bowls used on them

Booklat1 · 2018-10-29 16:47:41

pein wrote:

i would like cisterns to be same level as shallow well even if it holds less, maybe cost less
the bigger biome idea was popular, but we would need branches, water and milkweed in every biome

Biomes should never be so big that we only ever see one of them, just big enough that you don't have all five close by. In this scenario we would need some alternatives to rope and early water and soil, indeed. I do think that since there's so few biomes, even if he adds one or two more the map will already feel very different though. Its hard to make it so without new biomes meaning aethetics only though.

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2018-10-28 22:47:35

Water Needs to be Reworked

#2 2018-10-28 23:42:51

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#3 2018-10-28 23:50:48

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#4 2018-10-28 23:55:06

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#5 2018-10-29 00:16:56

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#6 2018-10-29 00:19:16

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#7 2018-10-29 00:39:26

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#8 2018-10-29 01:17:37

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#9 2018-10-29 06:11:10

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#10 2018-10-29 08:17:33

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#11 2018-10-29 16:37:30

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

#12 2018-10-29 16:47:41

Re: Water Needs to be Reworked

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