Warm rooms

YAHG · 2018-06-09 22:23:56

It would be cool if it was possible to make a warm room, like with floors and walls etc and firepit and the whole room would just be warm.

Then we could make places for the babies to live that were more than 1 tile so they can have toys and stuff.

Having some sort of "indoors" mechanic would be cool. Obviously farms are outside for now.

Rebel · 2018-06-09 23:34:19

Thought that was already a thing

Lotus · 2018-06-10 01:46:24

Hmm, maybe an enclosure with a fire inside. Warms the entire room to the heat of the fire? Or drops off as you inch away from the fire?

Rebel · 2018-06-10 01:55:02

I know people used to make rooms for babies, it's rarer now due to the hot biomes.

pein · 2018-06-10 06:51:22

i seen big cities with a lot of rooms, a baby kept in fire, private oven, private cart, everything private for a family, many of this rooms, they even closed the door on me after i took a firebrand and went second time for lighting it up in that room
looked soooo good, mainly scarce resources wont allow that

not sure how is calculated, i guess a fire makes a room hotter, also full bear rugs, that gives like 15-20% heat? so if you find a desert edge fragmented into something else and you got perfect to slightly cold tiles, you could make it

Izzytok · 2018-06-10 07:22:31

I've made a python simulation of heat transfer that's true to the game (I hope). I posted about it in this thread: Food Consumption vs Temperature.

Here's what's relevant to this thread:

Izzytok wrote:

Standing naked in a 3x3 adobe room with wooden floors, diagonally across from a slow fire, will give you a heat of 0.157. Standing outside the same distance away from a slow fire, that would be 0.139. Funnily enough, because of the way insulation works, and because the floors insulate, your corner of the room would have been warmer without the floors, having 0.187 heat in that situation.
If you're standing at the slow fire outside, you'd have a heat of 0.55 which is close to ideal. If you then build a 3x3 room with floors around the fire you get a heat of 0.66, or 0.62 without the floors.
I guess it's important to note that building floors around a fire will make the fire hotter, and the tiles outside the flooring cooler. It just kinda contains heat where the insulation is, which is why clothing is great untill you stand near a fire or in a desert. In that situation it just traps all the heat produced on that tile, inside the tile, and consequently - you.

So if my calculations aren't off, heated rooms aren't all that good right now; especially if you put floors down, since they limit the amount of heat that can spread out inside the room.

Last edited by Izzytok (2018-06-10 07:30:20)

Izzytok · 2018-06-10 07:45:06

I've also now tested it in the best clothes you can get (wolf hat, rabbit fur loincloth, rabbit fur shoes, sealskin coat), which gives you an insulation off 0.88 total.

If you stand on top of the fire in the corner of a 3x3 adobe room, you get 1 heat (max).

If you stand in the middle of such a room you have 0.39 heat, which is not bad, but you'd think you'd be burning up in full fur clothing inside a heated room, yet you're not even comfortably warm.

If you stand in a corner opposite to the fire, you'd have a heat of 0.38. Again, not bad but as far as realism goes it makes no sense.

For someone in full gear a desert tile hidden under a floor is a great starvation zone. The insulations add up, so in full gear on top of a wooden floor you have 0.98 insulation, so you keep all the heat that's produced on that tile pretty much. A desert tile produces heat, so that hidden desert gives someone in gear max heat, and is essentially worse than standing naked in snow.

Last edited by Izzytok (2018-06-10 07:45:58)

Rebel · 2018-06-10 07:59:29

Izzytok wrote:

I've also now tested it in the best clothes you can get (wolf hat, rabbit fur loincloth, rabbit fur shoes, sealskin coat), which gives you an insulation off 0.88 total.
If you stand on top of the fire in the corner of a 3x3 adobe room, you get 1 heat (max).
If you stand in the middle of such a room you have 0.39 heat, which is not bad, but you'd think you'd be burning up in full fur clothing inside a heated room, yet you're not even comfortably warm.
If you stand in a corner opposite to the fire, you'd have a heat of 0.38. Again, not bad but as far as realism goes it makes no sense.
For someone in full gear a desert tile hidden under a floor is a great starvation zone. The insulations add up, so in full gear on top of a wooden floor you have 0.98 insulation, so you keep all the heat that's produced on that tile pretty much. A desert tile produces heat, so that hidden desert gives someone in gear max heat, and is essentially worse than standing naked in snow.

sounds shitty, have you tested the room temps against outside temps one same biome?

Last edited by Rebel (2018-06-10 07:59:43)

Izzytok · 2018-06-10 08:04:38

Standing outside in full gear with no heat sources nearby will give you a heat of 0.27, and standing outside but on a single floor will give you 0.37 heat. 0.98 is so much insulation that unless the heatsource is on your tile, you ignore it. That's why it's so close to the temperatures inside the room.

Is this what you meant?

Last edited by Izzytok (2018-06-10 08:05:35)

Rebel · 2018-06-10 08:16:45

Izzytok wrote:

Standing outside in full gear with no heat sources nearby will give you a heat of 0.27, and standing outside but on a single floor will give you 0.37 heat. 0.98 is so much insulation that unless the heatsource is on your tile, you ignore it. That's why it's so close to the temperatures inside the room.
Is this what you meant?

kinda, so floors give heat?

What i was saying is do the same test, in a room and then do it outside and compare the heat,

So let's say you have a fire, inside a 5x5 right in the middle of the room, log the temps

Then make a fire outside with 5x5 space near it on the same biome as the house is built on and log temp of each tile. if you know floors give an extra 0.10 heat, you can work out if the walls actually do anything to help too.

Thus we could conclude if building rooms are worthless is better just build fences or corners of the house for segmenting professions

pein · 2018-06-10 08:27:39

i would be interested in the bear rug and in the stone patio too, should be something ideal
also how do i remove heat from a tile? making a tile next to it in cold?

Izzytok · 2018-06-10 09:00:30

Rebel wrote:

kinda, so floors give heat?

To clear that up first, floors give 0.1 insulation, which affects how the heat spreads. Basically when calculating where the heat goes it takes into account how much insulation neighbouring tiles have. A tile with 1 insulation has no heat transfer in or out, the only heat that is there is the heat produced on that tile (players, desert tiles and fires produce heat).

Alright now the test.

You have an adobe room with 3x3 internal space, with wooden floors around a central fire.

1.) you are standing in the upper left corner, naked, and you get 0.229 heat.

2.) you are standing above the fire, naked, and you get 0.306 heat.

3.) you are standing in the same tile as the fire, naked, and you get 0.666 heat.

Now we remove the room and and floors.

4.) diagonally up and to the left of the fire, naked, you get 0.208 heat.

5.) above the fire, naked, you get 0.266 heat.

6.) in the same tile as fire, naked, you get 0.554 heat.

The room apparently makes the tiles around the fire marginaly better, while it makes the fire itself too hot.

Izzytok · 2018-06-10 09:13:43

Here's what I was getting at with the post where I quoted myself:

If you have a fire inside the room, the whole room will be warmer if you don't make floors!

It's super weird but that's how it currently works. If we use the same examples as my previous post, but we remove the floors from the room we get:

1.) corner of room, naked, 0.370 heat.

2.) edge of room, naked, 0.391 heat.

3.) at fire, naked, 0.626.

The fire is slightly colder (which is good because it was too hot), and the rest of the room is warmer (which is good because it was too cold)!

Too be fair though, I don't see many rooms nowadays, especially not heated rooms. If there are rooms however people like to make floors for them (why wouldn't they?) and without a heatsource in the room it's better to have the floors to keep you warm.

Last edited by Izzytok (2018-06-10 09:14:32)

Tane · 2018-06-10 09:49:57

I don't think it would work with the way the game is modeled now anyway. It would cost too much in time/resources. Especially since Jason is going to make it harder to grow enough food to keep a village alive.
Its a good idea, but I think it will be too hard to execute. Even if the changes are made to the game, few will build one. Fact is, now the only reasons anyone makes housing now is for storage.

Rebel · 2018-06-10 10:06:00

Ah nice to know, good job.

strange how that works out.

Rebel · 2018-06-10 10:07:49

Tane wrote:

I don't think it would work with the way the game is modeled now anyway. It would cost too much in time/resources. Especially since Jason is going to make it harder to grow enough food to keep a village alive.
It's a good idea, but I think it will be too hard to execute. Even if the changes are made to the game, few will build one. Fact is, now the only reasons anyone makes housing now is for storage.

I just mentioned this in another thread.

I imagine in the future there could be items that only work inside rooms. Take a leaf out of ECOs book.
Would slow progression which is good, because atm it can be rushed out so quickly its stupid.

Tane · 2018-06-10 11:10:39

Rebel wrote:

Tane wrote:
I don't think it would work with the way the game is modeled now anyway. It would cost too much in time/resources. Especially since Jason is going to make it harder to grow enough food to keep a village alive.
It's a good idea, but I think it will be too hard to execute. Even if the changes are made to the game, few will build one. Fact is, now the only reasons anyone makes housing now is for storage.
I just mentioned this in another thread.
I imagine in the future there could be items that only work inside rooms. Take a leaf out of ECOs book.
Would slow progression which is good, because atm it can be rushed out so quickly its stupid.

Yeah, hopefully. It would help alot of the dynamics in the game.
The biggest issue is that its not really an advantage to have a house. Greifers would be a close second.

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2018-06-09 22:23:56

Warm rooms

#2 2018-06-09 23:34:19

Re: Warm rooms

#3 2018-06-10 01:46:24

Re: Warm rooms

#4 2018-06-10 01:55:02

Re: Warm rooms

#5 2018-06-10 06:51:22

Re: Warm rooms

#6 2018-06-10 07:22:31

Re: Warm rooms

#7 2018-06-10 07:45:06

Re: Warm rooms

#8 2018-06-10 07:59:29

Re: Warm rooms

#9 2018-06-10 08:04:38

Re: Warm rooms

#10 2018-06-10 08:16:45

Re: Warm rooms

#11 2018-06-10 08:27:39

Re: Warm rooms

#12 2018-06-10 09:00:30

Re: Warm rooms

#13 2018-06-10 09:13:43

Re: Warm rooms

#14 2018-06-10 09:49:57

Re: Warm rooms

#15 2018-06-10 10:06:00

Re: Warm rooms

#16 2018-06-10 10:07:49

Re: Warm rooms

#17 2018-06-10 11:10:39

Re: Warm rooms

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