How do predict private property will change the game?

Bob 101 · 2019-04-18 08:01:28

Best case scenario we'll have some actual business and trading emerge.

Or twins would abuse it by approving eachothers crap.

Booklat1 · 2019-04-18 09:19:32

i think this will be at best a wasted mechanic, at worse a griefing tool. already despise this update and what it stands for. seems the most backward design i've seen

i'm kinda hoping this fails horribly, specially since jason actually think cheap pens are acceptable.

olooopo · 2019-04-18 10:09:54

Worst case scenario for me would be if the meta shifts to using discord. If only discord users become first class citizen in the sense that only they get property right to the cool stuff like a Newcomen Engine (since if you have a discord name, you can be trusted) than I'm out of this game.

Besides that, I don't have much problem with this property idea at all. As long as people only claim property on stuff they actually made- who cares? However, I probably will stab a lot more people which steal stuff from the community and stash it away on their private property. A shovel does not belong to you even if you have smith it. But if you got the iron, made some steel and then smith the shovel, I'm ok with your claim on the shovel. Furthermore, people which take away my work (like rabbits I got or pie I made) from the camp to their property get stabbed as well.

Last edited by olooopo (2019-04-18 10:14:56)

pein · 2019-04-18 10:35:04

worst case scenario: people fill everything with their gates and fences to lock others up and steal whole buildings for themselves, starve others
rôle players will take over buildigs and resources then give ownership over it to each other and lock you out of it, then hunt you down
people will curse you for having things, and accuse you of hoarding stuff even if you made it (happened to me already)

prediction: people will make a lot in the new update and in total dumb places like under kiln so suicide rates will rise
lot of places will be ruined just by the many walls and no free tiles to walk on
so you either suicide (lot of people will be eve so no one can reject property)
or pseudo eve/adam and set up something then invite people over
people will be nice until you got stuff and you let them in then they waste it and maybe even kill you
more ways of hoarding stuff for themselves
dumb property fence pens which will not last and sheep will be scattered
lot more dogs and pigs and dumb stuff made

ideal meta: you make fences for more people symmetrically, and let them put a gate on it, old people need to choose a mentored kid who will inherit the property
ideally some marriage roleplay too cause people die like flies so rights will be lost, or each female one property, their sons can live same place

alternative uses: you can setup temporary sheep pen early
you can make a gate for each person and track if they alive
you can make duel arenas and mazes, training grounds

best case scenario: we make it meta that the shared city has properties on sides with roads between and people can do their shops
a good currency can be berry bowl with a carrot which is sheep food or compost, which always valuable
people will pay more respect to smart veterans who actually can make their own stuff, even if they roleplay as a decent person until they get what they want it's an advancement
some nice shopkeeper rp with actual profits for hard working players

Thaulos · 2019-04-18 11:18:24

People will use fences as ways to control an area like carrot farm or wheat or whatever and to enfirce empty tiles around. People will pribably start gravitating towards single job lives and will eventually start looking for heirs yo the said area. Perhaps as an helper.

Sheeps will be a lot faster to make but will be temporary and be replaced by the traditional ones we have now.

Buildings will disapear for the most part as they will become easy to grief vy ownership. Every important area such as the forge if owned will need to be in the open and at bow striking range to take out griefers.

Depending on how well the system is implemented different types of griefing will arise but I don't think it will be that bad. fences not that good for griefing. With perhaps griefers making small fences outside town and then putting tools inside and then giving ownership to someone else. This is not that different from putting them behind random far trees so I dont see it being too much of an issue as we already deal with the tree. variety and the added bonus of getting the tools back after the owner is dead.

It is not going to make families matter. We will just move from an anarcho commune to a place where we own areas in which priduction is done.

Tarr · 2019-04-18 12:20:21

It will dead content on arrival or be a major griefing tool. Normal players cannot even be trusted to build a proper building how can you expect them to be able to plan out fencing off an area? Have fun spending half your life setting up a fence system so you can """own""" something for thirty minutes before dying to pass it on to someone else in the village. Nothing in this game has any real sort of value besides the highest level of tech which you would just hide in the woods or something special like colored clothes.

If Jason wanted tot see more buildings in game he could easily buff cold buildings to be like their hot counterparts and suddenly it would make sense to build them. Instead we're getting magic god fences to solve some imaginary problem. There won't be trade, but there will be fence blocking, baby starvation fences, and of course hoarding because "I made dis."

Last edited by Tarr (2019-04-18 12:43:07)

futurebird · 2019-04-18 12:39:41

As most of you know I'm a giant touchy-feely hippy who mostly plays for the good vibes of helping other people, being helped, sharing, teaching others and learning. The big pay off for me is if I do something and other people appreciate it either by saying "thanks!" or by just using whatever I made. I'm kinda worried this update will make the game less fun for players like me, and there aren't a ton of games that are effective around these emotions and motivations.

So, I'm pretty ambivalent, I'm also really worried about the effort it will take to get all of my kids and brothers and sister added to any spaces I create. And if it takes effort will people make that effort for me?

Redram · 2019-04-18 16:08:34

pein wrote:

a good currency can be berry bowl with a carrot which is sheep food or compost, which always valuable

Where will this come from? The person who is the 'mint' and owns all the berries and carrots? Will every person have their own berry and carrot farm? Ya, you're definitely going to NEED that compost when everyone has their own farms to maintain. Berries are not ownable - your town will starve out. So do this thought experiment; irl, all the money is just in a big pile in the middle of the city. Anyone can grab it whenever they want. Does that sound like a stable or useful money supply? The bowls would be the defactor limiting factor in that currency system. You can't have the basic newb-sustaining food component be part of the money supply. Your town will starve to death. Iron is the only realistic option for 'money' right now. And there's just no point.

What I am hoping to see is pitbull pens, where a griefer breeds a pen full of pitbulls/wild boars near town, safe from interference, then lets them out to wreak havok. That would be hilarious. Probably hard for the griefer to survive to witness the end result though.

Tarr · 2019-04-18 16:56:28

Redram wrote:

What I am hoping to see is pitbull pens, where a griefer breeds a pen full of pitbulls/wild boars near town, safe from interference, then lets them out to wreak havok. That would be hilarious. Probably hard for the griefer to survive to witness the end result though.

This is a fantastic idea. Make the whole pen out of gates but don't name an heir to the pen and breed as many pitbulls/boars as you can and as soon as you die the pen will self-destruct thus leaving a giant mess of boars/pitbulls loose on the given area. I could definitely put this together as I have a pretty good history of boar collecting lel.

honikker · 2019-04-18 20:00:16

The ever-lauded efficiency might increase. People who know what they're doing can fence off certain areas, or make fences off areas for themselves to perform their chosen job. A baker can set up a fenced bakery and keep all the items they need therein, where meddlesome passers-by can't just grab, say, their round stone and run off with it. Someone who knows their way around a forge can set up a forge for themselves and keep their tools within their gate where people can't just nick their bellows and whatnot.

Personally, I can't wait to make a fenced-off bakery complete with a little wheat farm to the side so I can bake and distribute pies and bread in peace without someone filling my bowls with trash. I'm sure there's someone out there who likes forging things who would like to do the same, given all the complaints they lodge about people stealing all their bowls and plates, never mind the bellows. Pass them down to other people who know what they're doing and eventually they can create buildings and voila, shops. There's no currency so the shops would be obligated to put their completed items out for the general populace to use. I guess the currency can be knowing their stuff won't be messed with while they're away from their station.

This thread's just informative, though. I'll have to make my hypothetical bakery outside of town so people don't mess with my fence.

Psykout · 2019-04-18 20:06:46

Tarr wrote:

Redram wrote:
What I am hoping to see is pitbull pens, where a griefer breeds a pen full of pitbulls/wild boars near town, safe from interference, then lets them out to wreak havok. That would be hilarious. Probably hard for the griefer to survive to witness the end result though.
This is a fantastic idea. Make the whole pen out of gates but don't name an heir to the pen and breed as many pitbulls/boars as you can and as soon as you die the pen will self-destruct thus leaving a giant mess of boars/pitbulls loose on the given area. I could definitely put this together as I have a pretty good history of boar collecting lel.

images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcQ1-dbaQnM_wqC01eGspIusuhmk2z-tg4isXe1c0IGDS8Ifw4es

voy178 · 2019-04-19 00:43:44

It would be nice if it actually worked out, but towns are proper hot messes already. You just can't trust random players to build efficiently and even less aesthetically.

pein · 2019-04-19 06:18:12

Redram wrote:

pein wrote:
a good currency can be berry bowl with a carrot which is sheep food or compost, which always valuable
Where will this come from? The person who is the 'mint' and owns all the berries and carrots? Will every person have their own berry and carrot farm? Ya, you're definitely going to NEED that compost when everyone has their own farms to maintain. Berries are not ownable - your town will starve out. So do this thought experiment; irl, all the money is just in a big pile in the middle of the city. Anyone can grab it whenever they want. Does that sound like a stable or useful money supply? The bowls would be the defactor limiting factor in that currency system. You can't have the basic newb-sustaining food component be part of the money supply. Your town will starve to death. Iron is the only realistic option for 'money' right now. And there's just no point.
What I am hoping to see is pitbull pens, where a griefer breeds a pen full of pitbulls/wild boars near town, safe from interference, then lets them out to wreak havok. That would be hilarious. Probably hard for the griefer to survive to witness the end result though.

wanted to do similar experiment with pits, but even with them was too slow to build a decent shop
then the boxes became breakable, and they are the only thing that would let people exchange stuff

sure, you can hand out free food for masses, but no one can blame you for making your own food and asking for counter value for the excess

lets say i go and make a horse cart, then collect the clothes from far away
it's mine no? i found it
sure people are like, i steal your pack cause you already got one, and i don't let you exchange for something you need
but if they cannot access it then maybe you can tell them that: "hey, i went for this pack 200 tiles, i need pants for it"
some kids do ropes and buckets if you ask them, but lot of people are like "do it yourself, im too important, i will leach on you all your life and is nothing you can do"
now it's rp or real interest that drives you, an honorable shopkeeper who makes it's own stuff inside a property, can ask for things in return, and to work inside a property you need the only sustainable action in this game: sheep, pies, wheat, compost, carrots. make pies, fleece and soil, and use excess soil for ropes. You might need extra water inside or stuff like butt logs, but generally you can have a setup where you provide food for mothers and firewood, but if they want clothes or other luxuries, they need an effort of picking berries and carrot, fixing it.

it's mostly rp, it wont worth it for you, maybe you can get furs from one player and sell to other.

People like static jobs with a good reward
Composting was jasons idea, it's basically the main part of city life, you just create things out of thin air, with a profit, your work has a meaning.
Room making? you need to go out, nobody goes out and nobody gathers for others to use.
Egg cooking? sure, if someone gathers them, one player can cook it and have a job while others can eat.
Board cutting? i generally resort a kid to cut the boards and saves me a bit of time, as i collect the rest of butt logs
Gathering branches/kindling/clay? is very useful yet no one does it cause it takes time and it's no fun, but they love to burn charcoal for 1 tool or make stew pots when you need bowls.

I suggested family soup to be something with a long, more complex process, where you need several ingredients, the end result to be rewarding, and static type of food, ofc i suggested tables but jason just simplified it a bit and made stew, still very similar to what i suggested and people like to do it, they make their own farm, get their tools, make pottery, make stew and enjoy refilling them.

Im not into amassing wealth, i know that most people wong be able to compete with me, and im ok to sustain a small family all alone.
But there is one single thing what always annoys me: disgraceful people.
When a newbee gets you a branch and enjoys that you make tools with his help, you grind hard to help them.
When someone begs, threatens for clothes and weapons and when you ask to do something ignores you, i feel like "how can someone be so disgraceful?" people worked hard to build a town, spent their time creating things, wen to hunt rabbits for 20 min and hit a seal, so you can have their clothes.

I just want to see that people make some effort and understand that things arent free, others work hard so you can eat, have water and tools.

Right now people scavenge corpses, put them on kids and say that is your backpack, you don't give anyone cause your mother gave it, even the person who made that pack for 20 minutes can fuck off cause you own it.
Or you give a seal skin to a girl to keep her warm, and she gives to his son. Im like "i gave it to you for a reason, if you don't need it give it back"

Face it: some people just suicide if they don't have food supply and they say: oh i farmed last life, now i will chill and talk and let that idiot work alone. I was like this at start, i quit on lifes where i had to start from scratch, but when i first played as eve, realized how hard this game really is and you have to work most of your life to sustain a small family.

Probably wont be meta, but it's a good experiment to make others think. Right now your Mom who gears you with found clothes is a nice person, who fed you for all your life is a mean guy who want to tell you what to do. Is this even right?

Elsayal · 2019-04-19 08:50:42

futurebird wrote:

I'm also really worried about the effort it will take to get all of my kids and brothers and sister added to any spaces I create.

Don't trust all you children just because they are yours.

ProNice · 2019-04-19 11:22:14

I think it depends on how its implemented.

Private property in the real world is fundamentally enforced by small corrective micro-actions of violence.

To be able to defend property, we need ways to be violent without killing each other.

We need a gradient scale of violent options that don't involve cursing or stabbing/shooting people.

Also helpful would be the ability to identify/differentiate objects, so that they can be claimed with words.

Also useful: Taking an object claimed by a person should trigger slow movement, so there is a possibility to intervene.

After that, personal property will be claimed. It will be messy, but it will happen.

DestinyCall · 2019-04-19 13:59:29

First off ... this update doesn't give us private property. It gives us soul-bound gateways. I don't think we will see a free market society develop because of digital locks and cheap walls.

What I do imagine is a village that is chopped up by a bunch of poorly placed rickety fences that people keep fixing for the wrong reasons. Like when you are trying to move the central fire to a new location so you can finally finish the wood flooring and someone keeps adding firewood to the old one. So helpful! "That fire almost went out. I just saved the day. OH look! That fence is rickety. Better fix it ..." Adding more fences will be super easy, but getting rid of bad fences is hard and time consuming. Worse that fixing a berry patch. And there is currently no way to remove extra bundles of sticks, so if someone decides to spend their life making a really long fence or a bunch of short fences scattered everywhere, good luck getting rid of all the trash they leave behind when they die.

From what I can understand, Jason's intended vision for this update would involve everyone in the village having their own small "plot" of land where they can farm or work by themselves with their own supplies and equipment. So Farmer Joe has a fence around his carrot farm and Farmer Bob has a fence around his milkweed farm and Baker Tim has a fence around his wheat farm and Shepherd Daisy has a fence around her sheep and Smith Wendy has a fence around her smithy. Sounds good until you realize that in order for everyone to have a private, self-sufficient farm, all the farmers will need to have access to dirt and water and tools. In a perfect world, every one of those farms would have its own pond/well and soil deposits/compost piles. But that's very unlikely. In most villages, the ponds are scattered at random and the early village grows organically around the early ponds. If people start privatizing the water supply in an early village, there will be major problems. But let's assume that we figure out the water system. Maybe everyone gets their own bucket and the water remains public property. In that case, they still need to have access to dirt. Are compost piles also public property? Centrally located dirt and water wouldn't be too terrible, but that still means that someone has to dedicate their time to making those compost piles for general use and composting is a complex multi-step process. Your own private compost pile inside your dedicated fenced area would be much more convenient, but if you tried to make all the necessary ingredients from scratch by yourself it would take your entire life. And we haven't even talked about tools. If Farmer Joe has a dedicated carrot farm, he will want to have his own hoe so he doesn't need to go and steal/borrow Farmer Bob's hoe every time his hardened rows need tilling. Right now, different farms will share one or two hoes in most villages. In a privatized village, every farmer will need his own tools. Either stone hoes, steel hoes, or wild-gathered skewers. If domestically grown skewers worked for tilling, that might be a viable alternative or if the cost of milkweed was reduced, we could use stone hoes. But right now, any option would require a huge resource investment to supply everyone with their own hoes. At least it would keep Smith Wendy gainfully employed.

There's no way I see this update working as intended and stimulating actual trade. The best case scenario is that we find one or two ways to use the fences in a useful way that wasn't intended ... while griefers and new players discover a dozen different ways to break the village with badly positioned gates/fences.

antking:]# · 2019-04-19 14:23:06

well its to late now Jason is going through with this update no matter what we say all we can hope for is that the playerbase will respond positively

DestinyCall · 2019-04-19 14:47:50

antking:]# wrote:

well its to late now Jason is going through with this update no matter what we say all we can hope for is that the playerbase will respond positively

Oh I know. I am not happy about it, but there's no stopping it from happening. Just gonna have to deal. I expect this update will be a lot like the Temp update with the game practically unplayable for a while because of out-of-control fence building. Once the dust settles and we figure out what works and what doesn't, it will just be a low level annoyance to go around breaking fences and killing gate builders. At least the gates will be labeled, so it will be easy to figure out who needs to die.

Glassius · 2019-04-20 19:59:19

Every kulak needs to die, happy communictis paradise requires some sacrificies

I guess, ingame communism is very similar to real life!

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-04-18 08:01:28

How do predict private property will change the game?

#2 2019-04-18 09:19:32

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#3 2019-04-18 10:09:54

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#4 2019-04-18 10:35:04

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#5 2019-04-18 11:18:24

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#6 2019-04-18 12:20:21

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#7 2019-04-18 12:39:41

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#8 2019-04-18 16:08:34

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#9 2019-04-18 16:56:28

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#10 2019-04-18 20:00:16

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#11 2019-04-18 20:06:46

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#12 2019-04-19 00:43:44

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#13 2019-04-19 06:18:12

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#14 2019-04-19 08:50:42

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#15 2019-04-19 11:22:14

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#16 2019-04-19 13:59:29

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#17 2019-04-19 14:23:06

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#18 2019-04-19 14:47:50

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

#19 2019-04-20 19:59:19

Re: How do predict private property will change the game?

Board footer