Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

Doctor Steve · 2018-08-20 08:39:38

hihibanana wrote:

It seems you're trying to use all of these words to manipulate people, to distract them from seeing your true stance on the matter, because neither I, nor anyone, can really see your stance.

Would you rather Pharo draw you a picture? If you feel like you're being (almost) manipulated by what Pharo is saying that means that Pharo made a good argument and a part of you knows it. I see Pharo's stance and I agree with them 100%, and I know many players who do.

hihibanana wrote:

What is wrong with you, Pharo? I'm not trying to be mean, but you should really see someone about that attitude.

hihibanana wrote:

If you haven't felt it, you are a psychopath. What is more important? That you can contribute to the game, or that someone else can have fun in the game?

All talk about the game aside, telling someone they have a serious mental illness to try to negate their argument is not only incredibly irresponsible, childish, and reinforces the taboo around mental illnesses, it demonizes those who actually live with psychopathic disorders as well. I highly doubt you're a psychologist, so you don't get to go around throwing diagnoses all willy-nilly.

hihibanana wrote:

no matter what argument you have, killing people in this game is not excusable.

Wrong again!

This is an online multiplayer game where you play with strangers and Jason has made it very clear that he isn't going to hold our hands when it comes to dispute resolution (fights or arguments). If you do something or are doing something that someone else doesn't like, and they try to talk it through with you, they have every right to stab your character if you don't TRY to work it out. If someone comes up to you and says "Hey can you water the berries?" when all you've done is eaten food and nothing else, and you ignore them or something, then yeah you're being a jerk and we can get you out of our city if we want. It's how the game works.

No one has ever said roleplaying is griefing. I love to roleplay in this game, it's part of the fun! What you need to remember is that this is just a game and the way people act in game does not have any bearing on who they are as people. I have a game called Mount and Blade: Warband, and through my character I have happily ridden a horse through hordes of enemies with an ax, lobbing their heads off. Does that make me a serial killer? No. Do I condone violence in real life against real people? Absolutely NOT. And sure, people can justify their griefer actions by saying something like "the real world is full of griefers" and yeah, they're right, but it also has laws and penalties for being a "griefer" too. We don't have jails in this game, only weapons, so if you grief, then you get stabbed.

The point is that you KNOW these things are frustrating and the majority of people don't like it when you do them so you CANNOT be surprised when someone comes up to your character with a knife and stabs you. You do the crime, you do the time. I don't know why this is such an abstract concept.

hihibanana wrote:

We're asking you to stop assuming people that do nothing are griefing, because whoever came up with "sponging" has no idea what they're talking about, and is making up excuses to kill people. And you're supporting it. And other people are supporting it. Just don't. You don't know the true short-term and long-term ramifications of assuming someone is doing nothing, and killing them. It's bad for the game, the community, our progress in the game as a whole, and, most importantly, our enjoyment of a game.

If everyone just sat around and ate food, there would be no food left. Right? Producing enough food to feed everyone takes a lot of effort, and often one person does pies or berries or stew. Why should that person spend their whole "life" toiling on making food for someone whose only purpose is to sit around eating it? If I were the stew person and I saw someone just hanging around the stew all their life eating it and doing nothing, I'd stab them.

The fun part about this game IS working. It's about building farms, farming and making food, and creating an infrastructure. Someone who plunks themselves down at a berry bush and just eats until they die is not an innocent person in this, they are griefing.

Since you seem to be confused by well-thought out arguments written in plain English (you call 'fancy poetry'), I'm going to break it down for you in a nice easy-to-read list. Please take as much time as you need to read it over, and let me know if you have any questions!

You might be a griefer if you:
- hide the tools and weapons
- sit around eating food and nothing else
- intentionally drain resources for the sake of draining resources (see also, eating all the food)
- lock all the things
- run around like a maniac as a baby (I let those babies die)
- kill all the sheep
- shear all the sheep and don't feed them ever
- kill all the women
- kill the babies by throwing them at snakes or something

I'm sure I'm missing some.

So to re-cap:

Being a fat lazy slob is griefing.
Pharo is right.
Stop trying to use mental illnesses as weapons for poorly made arguments.

hihibanana · 2018-08-20 08:50:38

Do you understand the purpose of an argument? It's to find truth, not to make peace. Just because I'm responding to him, doesn't mean I'm "falling" for some sort of manipulation. That assumes he's trolling, which he isn't. He's misguided and severely needs help. Mental illness isn't an argument. It's an aspect of truth you should assume no one is using as an argument, unless they're trying to harass others. The fun in this game is different for anyone. The fundamentals of your arguments are so far off, it's like you don't even have the skill to produce results in your own "craft". Try to use words in a responsible manner. I know it sounds like I'm echoing your words, but you're being a really nasty hypocrite.

Edit: Try to use less words next time. More words doesn't make you more right. An opinion doesn't make you right either.

Last edited by hihibanana (2018-08-20 08:53:23)

MultiLife · 2018-08-20 09:05:22

Purpose of an argument is to sit down to listen to two sides, hopefully learn both stances and then continue to disagree peacefully or come to a conclusion and agreement. Truth is not the same to other people.

hihibanana · 2018-08-20 09:12:33

MultiLife wrote:

Purpose of an argument is to sit down to listen to two sides, hopefully learn both stances and then continue to disagree peacefully or come to a conclusion and agreement. Truth is not the same to other people.

You're talking about mediation (to make things peaceful) and compromise. There is nothing to mediate nor compromise here, and therefore the purpose of these arguments is to find truth.

Last edited by hihibanana (2018-08-20 09:13:21)

Doctor Steve · 2018-08-20 09:37:46

hihibanana wrote:

The fundamentals of your arguments are so far off, it's like you don't even have the skill to produce results in your own "craft".

Oh? Explain. Show me where my "fundamentals" have gone "so far off", since you are the expert. Also I am interested in what you think my 'craft' is, because I know that no matter what you guess you're going to be wrong.

hihibanana wrote:

Do you understand the purpose of an argument?

The purpose of an argument is to actually convince someone that your view/opinion is the correct one. Arguments/debates do not uncover any truth whatsoever and they CERTAINLY don't make peace.

hihibanana wrote:

Just because I'm responding to him, doesn't mean I'm "falling" for some sort of manipulation.

Never said you were "falling" for anything, but you did say in your previous post that you felt that Pharo was trying to manipulate people with their words, and if you found that they seemed manipulative then you must have been manipulated by them just a little bit.

hihibanana wrote:

Edit: Try to use less words next time. More words doesn't make you more right. An opinion doesn't make you right either. :roll:

I will use as many words as I like, thank you. Once again, I never implied that an opinion made me right nor did I ever use "I think" statements, which would have turned my statements into opinions. I explained my stand point on the situation using concrete, real-world examples of a crime = punishment model of civilization which I am fairly confident in assuming is a global system (though some cultures' laws are crimes in other cultures). The fact of the matter is that in a civilization, which this game imitates, there are consequences to certain actions and it should be clear to you by now which things people consider to be "against the law", since I assume you have been comparing and contrasting griefer and anti-griefer posts. Basically, if you do something you know people aren't going to like, they're going to retaliate.

Also, I appreciate the fact that you made an edit to add more words to your post telling me to use less words in mine.

hihibanana wrote:

He's misguided and severely needs help. Mental illness isn't an argument. It's an aspect of truth you should assume no one is using as an argument, unless they're trying to harass others.

Okay, one more time, YOU don't get to decide that about Pharo just because you don't agree with how they play the game. If you had not tried to use mental illness as an argument I would have never THOUGHT you were using it as an argument. Not even an argument, but an insult, or something that would make someone reading your post think "Hihibanna says Pharo's a psychopath? Oh no, well we can't be agreeing with a psychopath!"

If you would like to take my previous post and show me where my argument falls short, I would absolutely LOVE to see your analysis. I can only assume you are the absolute expert in this, and a master wordsmith to boot.

MultiLife · 2018-08-20 09:41:41

hihibanana wrote:

MultiLife wrote:
Purpose of an argument is to sit down to listen to two sides, hopefully learn both stances and then continue to disagree peacefully or come to a conclusion and agreement. Truth is not the same to other people.
You're talking about mediation (to make things peaceful) and compromise. There is nothing to mediate nor compromise here, and therefore the purpose of these arguments is to find truth.

You are proving me right: your "truth" of what an argument is is already different from mine, so looking for "truth" is going to go nowhere in this discussion. You are expecting a split of "people who are wrong" and "people who are right" but in this case it is not so black and white. It rarely is.
In this case you should take your truth and listen to other people's truths. They are different and will be different. There won't be any ultimate, above others truths. Except the truth that people will always disagree.

Last edited by MultiLife (2018-08-20 09:50:36)

MultiLife · 2018-08-20 10:18:06

Anyways, regarding the original post, what I wanted to message here was:
basically, nobody has a right over others to dictate how they should play the game. But. People can kill people in this game. And that will happen. Always.

Here are some thoughts that hover around this subject:
"Some people should chill"
Sure. There are some players who are very short-tempered. If they got a weapon, they can act out on a whim, on their impulses and do as they please, just like anyone else.

"Let me have my fun"
Have it. Better yet, go have it somewhere where you can support having your own fun. You'll be safe and won't bother anyone. It'd be polite to do it like that. Not all experience your fun as fun.

"Nobody should be killed"
I disagree. But it'd be great if there were special servers for people who want no killing. Griefers would prolly love to mess up their towns though, by using the soil and making messes, trashing stuff, locking things and so on.

"People are killing harmless people"
Yes. People can do whatever they want just like you can too. You want to honk a goose throughout your life? Someone might want to kill you. Both can do whatever however. I'd advice the goose honker to honk the goose somewhere else (and forage food for themselves to continue doing that away from others).
But what is a harmless player? One who doesn't kill, one who doesn't work, one who at least isn't draining the resources...?
Nobody here on this thread wants to kill just harmless people. Nobody here wants to carry people either. People have different opinions on what is fun and what is annoying, what is lazing around and what is idle time. People who wield weapons just have a bit more power to back their actions. That's just how it is. Sometimes jokesters are not wanted. Sometimes they actually are a drain to towns.

Also, as a note. Some griefers can just simply "play you": They mimic veterans and act like them and then do unfair kills and screech out things like "they didn't do work" just to get two sides against each other. Sometimes it is a burnout veteran player, sometimes it is a long-time griefer/murderer who knows how to play the community and get them riled up.
Griefers also can and will "play dumb" and take on a role of a newbie. Yes, sometimes a real newbie is killed, and sometimes it was a griefer playing "the noob card".
Don't worry, every innocent one gets to respawn anyways. I was killed as an innocent player, and got a nice life right after. No problemo.

Last edited by MultiLife (2018-08-20 10:35:09)

I am Pharo · 2018-08-20 10:42:20

hihibanana wrote:

What is wrong with you, Pharo? I'm not trying to be mean, but you should really see someone about that attitude. Always trying to pinpoint it one someone else. Not taking responsibility for your actions. It seems you're trying to use all of these words to manipulate people, to distract them from seeing your true stance on the matter, because neither I, nor anyone, can really see your stance. All it seems you're doing is defending yourself, and putting people between you and some invisible "attack", when no one is attacking you at all. We're asking you to stop assuming people that do nothing are griefing, because whoever came up with "sponging" has no idea what they're talking about, and is making up excuses to kill people. And you're supporting it. And other people are supporting it. Just don't. You don't know the true short-term and long-term ramifications of assuming someone is doing nothing, and killing them. It's bad for the game, the community, our progress in the game as a whole, and, most importantly, our enjoyment of a game. You cannot ignore these consequences, because I'm sure you know they're real, and have felt them. People on the forums that talk about murder like it's fun. People on the forums that talk about killing griefers like it's fun. People on the forums that complain that they can't kill griefers easily, people on the forums talking about how they cannot murder other people easily. People do not care about the game, or its progress. They want it to be a stress-relief game, where they can kill anonymously without consequences. And that's scary. And it's scary to have people like that in our community... no matter what argument you have, killing people in this game is not excusable.
If you haven't felt it, you are a psychopath. What is more important? That you can contribute to the game, or that someone else can have fun in the game?
And please don't try to use some fancy poetry. It doesn't work on me.

Bruh.... are you serious, my guy?

WTF are you even talking about?!

I've said enough, and I've said it well.
Fuck you for calling me a psychopath.
Fuck that other guy, for calling me Fascist.
And a big ol' fuck you for saying I have an attitude problem.

You hit me up with replies like
"You have an attitude problem" "You should leave the game" "You are a psychopath"

How the fuck do you think im going to talk to you, whisper sweet lullabies to you?

Getthefuckouttahere, my guy.

boggers · 2018-08-20 11:32:29

I'm very new to the game, joined late, maybe 15 hours in. I do not know what the game was like before the curse system was in place, but reading these forums it sounds like griefers used to be a much bigger problem than they are now. For me it is people with the attitude supported by I am Pharo in this thread that ruin the game, I probably will not continue to play it.

I have been killed without explanation several times for being new and clueless, or tasked with something so menial that I remain new and clueless ("your job is putting berries in bowls") I have learnt far more reading forums and watching let's play videos on youtube than anyone ever showed me in game.

It is because of people like I am Pharoah that I will feed cursed kids if the town I'm in is even a little bit draconian.

Catfive · 2018-08-20 11:42:25

sanchez wrote:

Until that day comes and ppl learn that having weps around is good thing ima go on rampage.
Or just bake pies like i always do.

I always establish where there is at least a knife I can make or get hold of and tuck it in my backpack (also a first priority). I won't use it unless it is needed but I'll also make sure sheep excess are killed off and bread cut etc so it is not some prized possession, just a tool to do what is needed in the settlement or against those who earn it

I'm a big fan of having at least 4 or 5 armed productive people in every settlement

Last edited by Catfive (2018-08-20 11:45:42)

Catfive · 2018-08-20 11:57:09

boggers wrote:

I'm very new to the game, joined late, maybe 15 hours in. I do not know what the game was like before the curse system was in place, but reading these forums it sounds like griefers used to be a much bigger problem than they are now. For me it is people with the attitude supported by I am Pharo in this thread that ruin the game, I probably will not continue to play it.
I have been killed without explanation several times for being new and clueless, or tasked with something so menial that I remain new and clueless ("your job is putting berries in bowls") I have learnt far more reading forums and watching let's play videos on youtube than anyone ever showed me in game.
It is because of people like I am Pharoah that I will feed cursed kids if the town I'm in is even a little bit draconian.

I learnt far more 'out of game' or just watching people in game too but then the comms system if you're not on voice is extremely limiting.. it is a very tough game because you are not just fighting the game for survival.. you're also fighting other people in many senses. Players in these environments tend to always react this way: you kill anything that could make survival any tougher. Seen it half a dozen times evolve this exact same way such as in Felucca in Ultima Online 20 years ago and again in shadowbane/darkfall communities. I actually prefer this type of game but it isn't for everyone. You complained you were tasked with putting berries in bowls, assumably for compost makers.. You could also be watering and reviving berry bushes, establishing and maintaining water sources, assisting on other farms such as stew (which will be nearby). I start every life the same as this, make sure the food base is strong, expand it as necessary, ensure it all ticks over smoothly. If you want to do something a bit different, learn how from videos or even the tutorial, for smithing, then just look for the weak point in the chains such as iron supply, hunting, farming, building - and get on it.

Oh and if you feed cursed babies you're marked too

Last edited by Catfive (2018-08-20 11:57:31)

hihibanana · 2018-08-20 12:10:11

Doctor Steve wrote:

Doctor Steve's post.

First of all, your post has a lot of assumptions in what I'm talking about. No amount of words are going to justify making an assumption in an argument. Isn't this amateurish? For someone who knows so much about argument (again, you're being a hypocrite).

Crime and crime-fighting in real life isn't perfect. Why would it work in this game, when often, we're convinced that it's working when it's not?

Do you not think people can be sympathetic and understanding in a post? You think people turn a blind eye to other people's emotions? I can tell Pharo is mentally ill, and you're pretending I'm insulting him by pointing it out? This mindset silences many many people who have real illnesses, and shames them from speaking up about it. Illumination allows healing. Please don't be an arse.

MultiLife wrote:

MultiLife's post.

I'm not talking about personal truths. If I was, I would agree with you. I'm talking about objective truths. It's possible to find it, but if you assume you can't, you won't find it in an infinite amount of years.

Your reply expresses your own truth, and doesn't make room for finding the truth. This is very harmful and unuseful to the thread as a whole. In fact, it's very hard to reply to it in a useful manner. I will say these few things, however: mentally ill people do play this game. They do wish to kill people because they have mental illness. They often do so because they don't see themselves as hurting anybody. They have to know that they are in fact hurting people's experiences, and it's very harmful to someone's health. Ignorance will be healed by getting the points of views by those affected. Please support the overall health of this community, rather than focusing on some sort of debate "a rando" started.

I Am Pharo wrote:

I Am Pharo's post.

I'm completely serious. Your actions mimic that of a depressed, anxious psychopath, and it would be healthier for everyone if you were to leave and work on yourself. I am not insulting you. I am stating my observation that I 100% believe, and know that you're not mentally stable. The correct way to act is to respect others, and express your emotions in a healthy manner. Even with this, we can see that you're not stable. It's ok to be mentally ill, because it's not something you could have prevented. Working on yourself will allow you to get through it.

Last edited by hihibanana (2018-08-21 14:21:41)

Solbusaur · 2018-08-20 12:12:11

Cursing should come before stabbing. Stabbing just creates more problems than there already are, such as revenge and curses towards the killer.

I am Pharo · 2018-08-20 12:19:01

Everything Dr Steve said

All the bumps.

Edited to remove accidental link.
Also to add, "go fuck yourself, hihibanana."

Last edited by I am Pharo (2018-08-20 12:23:44)

I am Pharo · 2018-08-20 12:52:14

boggers wrote:

I'm very new to the game, joined late, maybe 15 hours in. I do not know what the game was like before the curse system was in place, but reading these forums it sounds like griefers used to be a much bigger problem than they are now. For me it is people with the attitude supported by I am Pharo in this thread that ruin the game, I probably will not continue to play it.
I have been killed without explanation several times for being new and clueless, or tasked with something so menial that I remain new and clueless ("your job is putting berries in bowls") I have learnt far more reading forums and watching let's play videos on youtube than anyone ever showed me in game.
It is because of people like I am Pharoah that I will feed cursed kids if the town I'm in is even a little bit draconian.

Although you have the right to, it's not wise to enter a debate with people who have played through 25+ versions of the game, killed dozens of griefers, prolonged the legacy of countless family lines, and expect to come out on the side of reason.

Griefing is, has been, and will continue be a big issue in this game, especially with people like you and others enacting, encouraging, enabling grief.

If people talk about grief less than before, which I doubt, I imagine the reason is, we as a community have accepted that squashing grief and trolling, is a part of the game, like smithing, it takes time to get good at.

Some of us all the game "Two Griefers One Life"

Also: did you not hear of the butter knife glitch from about a week ago?
Griefing was at an all time high, until a hotfix.
It was a bloody weekend.

Feeding cursed kids doesn't seem reasonable response, but do you, troll.
Though, be warned: you are putting your self at risk, many villages do curse checks, and so they will kill you and the cursed babies.

If you're not going to continue playing then bye, Felicia
Maybe OHOL isn't for you.

MultiLife · 2018-08-20 12:56:49

hihibanana wrote:

MultiLife wrote:
MultiLife's post.
I'm not talking about personal truths. If I was, I would agree with you. I'm talking about objective truths. It's possible to find it, but if you assume you can't, you won't find it in an infinite amount of years.
Your reply expresses your own truth, and doesn't make room for finding the truth. This is very harmful and unuseful to the thread as a whole. In fact, it's very hard to reply to it in a useful manner. I will say these few things, however: mentally ill people do play this game. They do wish to kill people because they have mental illness. They often do so because they don't see themselves as hurting anybody. They have to know that they are in fact hurting people's experiences, and it's very harmful to someone's health. Ignorance will be healed by getting the points of views by those affected. Please support the overall health of this community, rather than focusing on some sort of debate "a rando" started.

You are making a lot of assumptions here, including this "you must be mentally ill" thing to another user. You are voicing your truths as much as I am voicing mine and then you say I'm hampering the "finding the truth". Objective truth? A common sense view? This is just a forum filled with people with opinions and experiences, what kind of truth are you trying to uncover here? One that fits your stance? I have no idea anymore what we are after here.

Isn't it more harmful to conclude that players who kill are mentally ill? I think that is muuuuch more harmful than me voicing my opinions, trying to shed light to the other side of the spectrum where you just stamp an "ill" mark on. I'm saying there is no one big truth that can be raised above others, but you are talking about finding that. There is no opinion or truth that can be raised above others. There are just matters that some agree on and some disagree on. Just because some opinions differ greatly, doesn't make anyone ill or anything less. Or their opinions obstructive.

Common sense of view: killing other players and being mean and unjustified is bad. Let's have fun and do great things.
Not-so-common sense of view: some players are here to ruin games and me killing them is justified. I must stop others' "fun" to let majority have their fun.

*shrug*

Last edited by MultiLife (2018-08-20 13:09:14)

MultiLife · 2018-08-20 13:06:02

boggers wrote:

I have been killed without explanation several times for being new and clueless, or tasked with something so menial that I remain new and clueless ("your job is putting berries in bowls") I have learnt far more reading forums and watching let's play videos on youtube than anyone ever showed me in game.
It is because of people like I am Pharoah that I will feed cursed kids if the town I'm in is even a little bit draconian.

Please don't do that, other nice players will suffer because you are trying to get some sort of revenge over things. Don't get offended but it is immature and selfish behavior to revenge and let innocent people suffer.
There are mean players as there are mean people, but letting others suffer indirectly or directly will just feed the flames and the downspiral continues. I'd say the revenge mentality is what keeps people so negative.

If you end up living with horrible players, just let go and advance to the next life. No need to sit and suffer, go on, you have the power. I know I ran when I was born to a cursed mom talking about me being a sex slave. And what do you know, amazing life right after that!

I was a new player just under a month ago. I also watched videos and learned through them. 60 minutes goes by so fast in-game, it is rare to get time to teach. I don't expect people to teach me but I do teach others whenever I can. It is, still, most effecient to keep watching newest videos and hearing about tips rather than wait for someone in-game to grant their knowledge upon you. Communication is not easy in-game so teaching is not easy either.

hihibanana · 2018-08-20 14:10:46

I'm not really making assumptions. I'm making observations that are true. If I were voicing my truth, it would be far different. For example, I would prefer him to speak in a way that would allow him to empower those around him, while he is here. Objectively he should stop and work on himself. The former wouldn't be as healthy, and that's why the best option is the latter. Not common sense; you're making assumptions now. It is possible to find an objective truth, but you must believe it's possible. Again, this post is filled with your truth, and doesn't seek to find the truth. As such, it is harmful to this thread's goal of finding the truth of the matter, and is still really hard to reply to in a meaningful way.

Last edited by hihibanana (2018-08-20 14:13:08)

I am Pharo · 2018-08-20 14:23:33

hihibanana wrote:

I'm not really making assumptions. I'm making observations that are true. If I were voicing my truth, it would be far different. For example, I would prefer him to speak in a way that would allow him to empower those around him, while he is here, while, objectively he should stop and work on himself. The former wouldn't be as healthy, and that's why the best option is the latter. Not common sense; you're making assumptions now. It is possible to find an objective truth, but you must believe it's possible. Again, this post is filled with your truth, and doesn't seek to find the truth. As such, it is harmful to this thread's goal of finding the truth of the matter, and is still really hard to reply to in a meaningful way.

I was done being civil with you at least three posts ago, so again:
Go fuck yourself.
You aren't a psychologist.
Your observations hold no merit here.

I've played with Mirelli, Turnipseed, Dr. Steve, Pein, Chu Tarr, and other great community members... they've been witnesses to my playstyle,
and can back me up,
I do not just murder people senselessly,
nor do I seek to throw around my weight
just because I can.

Comparing me to people like that is a false observation, so fuck you.

Love,
Pharo

P S - Eat ass.

Edited for accidental link, and one more Fuck You to hihibanana

Last edited by I am Pharo (2018-08-20 14:25:11)

hihibanana · 2018-08-20 14:27:51

I'm talking to MultiLife.

Edit: Mental illness has a process and pattern. Just because there is one, doesn't mean there is no mental illness.

Last edited by hihibanana (2018-08-20 14:28:32)

TrustyWay · 2018-08-20 14:32:27

If you want to roleplay a character, I wouldn't mind. Bring some eggs and woods, do some stuffs so you do your parts but go ahead, roleplay.

People that don't like roleplay shouldn't threathen roleplayers, they are just killing the game, they are even worst than griefers.

pein · 2018-08-20 15:54:03

destroying, undoing others work is griefing
even if you do it with no information/bad information, multiple times
or if you ignore or talk back when someone mentions the problem you caused

you call me rude but at least i warn you

even if you take a branch without asking, says a lot about you, cause someone clearly using it in a station and you are too lazy to find one yourself
'its just a branch' - its just a branch for you as well, when im going for the 3rd one cause you keep cutting/taking it then i just wasted 5 minutes
same goes for watering carrots without picking them off, you are not helping, you are griefing
some lifes i need to pick it off like 4 times and tell people not to water anymore

yesterday was mirellis daughter
my sister just tended to kids so i gave her a few more
ii was busy getting back sheep, getting wheat and organizing the city
mirelli got iron for us and i could made hoe

while most kids were understanding
my big siter raised one, she came when she was 39, i fed her the last years
my daughter just left her somewhere
was like 'i dont water the wheat cause food is too far' /15 tiles?
when i brought bowls in a cart, and asked her to fill it: 'do it yourself'
i did, but then i stabbed her, cause what use she has to us?

http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … &id=908693
it was a clown fiesta

have some backbone and work a bit
its a crafting game, its fun to craft
you dont need to work on food necessarily, but when you dont realize how much work you make for others by not doing things or undoing things
then you deserve to die, its a gamble you make and you can get away with it most cases

its not hard and all, most things are set it and forget it, i can plant 30 wheat in a lifetime with no issue
why cant you plant 5? you got enough time to talk after you fixed berry bushes

in real life you need to work to eat, you need to buy the clothes you wear
no different in a virtual society, dont take things for granted

there is a lot to do which is not repetitive or boring, i get it you dont wanna farm, then go and scout out, bring stuff back, flat rocks, clay

there are three things which makes a city a city
first you need to make an axe before branches run out
then a shovel before water runs out/sometimes move to new location
and compost before soil runs out

therefore not helping on this, makes you useless to a city
doing something else is kinda griefing, why would you make pies before sheep?
why make fur clothes with milkweed?

get the branches for tools, bring clay, once i enough its no problem afterwards

all i see is people run to get all the clothes then do nothing, starve, then nobody cares about a baby girl crying, everybody watches the drama of a fmale getting killed then blames the killer, while the baby dies, cause most of you cares only about himself
its a main goal of the game, the survival of the lineage, if you dont care about it at least dont block the ones who do
because sometimes i understand killers, when 30 babies run around and no work gets done, people ignore the babies and they are born back

generally i run around, doing the most important stuff, getting a cart of clay or firewood, making a pen, getting cow, but often i make roads or rooms when i see things are running well, when not, i instruct people around me what to do, i see the bigger picture, most of them wont but they expect everything to be there, some people run for clothes or a hoe for 30 minutes
there are things to do, im playing just a few hours after update, and its fun making roads and railroads, how you get bored of the game when you cant even make a successful eve run? never made tortilla in the game or never made an apron?

you can roleplay running from bush to bush in the forest for all i care
its not hard to water 30 bushes, can be done in 5 minutes then go around and talk, your existence is payed

truth is that if everybody works for a few minutes, you will have 30-40 minutes to eat pies and do whatever you please
even an experienced player cant do alone everything, on an eve camp i struggle to feed more than 2 persons, in a city, its not much fun fixing everything and never be on a point where i can take a cart, get some flat rocks and make a road

i might kill more people than most of you
but i save much more indirectly

at least if you read forums, the general rule should be to produce more than you use up and try to care about the babies
it takes 3 feedings if the baby is on a medium temperature and if its a noob it dies anyway, if runs around then its a waste of time
the rest could be and should be saved
and dont be a selfish asshole, or accept the risk of being killed for it

boggers · 2018-08-20 23:37:02

MultiLife wrote:

Please don't do that, other nice players will suffer because you are trying to get some sort of revenge over things. Don't get offended but it is immature and selfish behavior to revenge and let innocent people suffer.
There are mean players as there are mean people, but letting others suffer indirectly or directly will just feed the flames and the downspiral continues. I'd say the revenge mentality is what keeps people so negative.
If you end up living with horrible players, just let go and advance to the next life. No need to sit and suffer, go on, you have the power. I know I ran when I was born to a cursed mom talking about me being a sex slave. And what do you know, amazing life right after that!
I was a new player just under a month ago. I also watched videos and learned through them. 60 minutes goes by so fast in-game, it is rare to get time to teach. I don't expect people to teach me but I do teach others whenever I can. It is, still, most effecient to keep watching newest videos and hearing about tips rather than wait for someone in-game to grant their knowledge upon you. Communication is not easy in-game so teaching is not easy either.

It's not about revenge, my worldview leans toward anti-authoritarian. Murder is murder, people who murder "for the greater good" deserve griefers and vice versa.

For context, doing the tutorial, I wanted to make a bow and arrow, but there are no geese in the tutorial area. In my first game ever, there were bows lying around everywhere in a village, so I put together an arrow from scratch. I think I was still too young to wield it, I'm still not even sure if that is a rule, anyway as I am standing there trying to combine the bow with arrow and it isn't working, some self appointed "protector" comes over, berates me, then shoots me. No questions, no explanations. Welcome to the game.

As far as I am concerned, that is griefing. I have no sympathy for that kind of behaviour or anyone who implicitly condones it by living there.

Those who trade freedom for security deserve neither, and all that.

hihibanana · 2018-08-20 23:54:29

By their own logic, killing innocent people is griefing.

Doctor Steve · 2018-08-21 00:31:33

hihibanana wrote:

By their own logic, killing innocent people is griefing.

Congratulations! Killing innocent people is griefing!

But we're not talking about innocent people, we're talking about people who passively undermine the work of every other player that has ever lived in a given community.

I think it is obvious that you are intentionally misunderstanding the situation. Killing because you enjoy killing other characters is called griefing. Killing someone FOR griefing is called justice. It's not an argument about whether or not the act of killing, on its own, is good or bad. It's an argument about not if but when it is justifiable to kill someone in game.

You say that killing is unacceptable under any circumstance and that people should be allowed to do whatever they want, even to the detriment of other players, for the sake of their own 'fun'. What many of us are saying is that when someone comes along and decides to ruin the things that we were doing in-game just because they like to "have fun" or "mess around" with people, we don't like it. We try to tell you we don't like it, and for you to say "but you're not listening to the truth that it's MY fun, so I deserve to be able to do it without consequences" is ridiculous.

By the way truth is not subjective, there is no such thing as your truth or my truth there is only the truth. Truth exists whether we agree with it or not, but the truth is the same for everyone because the truth doesn't care what we want. Reality can be subjective-- your reality may be different from my reality. But truth is just there. Just like how "alternative facts" are not actually factual and are, in fact, lies.

To be perfectly clear I do not condone killing innocent players, but when a baby starts trying to pick up a bow and arrow right out of the gate I do get suspicious because 9/10 times that baby turns into a griefer. I agree that some people are a bit trigger happy and I have been murdered because someone thought I was a griefer (case of mistaken identity), but other players defended me in that situation.

If no one defends you, perhaps you were being a dick.

Still waiting on that analysis.

Edit: spelling goof.

Last edited by Doctor Steve (2018-08-21 00:32:08)

One Hour One Life Forums

#26 2018-08-20 08:39:38

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#27 2018-08-20 08:50:38

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#28 2018-08-20 09:05:22

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#29 2018-08-20 09:12:33

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#30 2018-08-20 09:37:46

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#31 2018-08-20 09:41:41

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#32 2018-08-20 10:18:06

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#33 2018-08-20 10:42:20

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#34 2018-08-20 11:32:29

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#35 2018-08-20 11:42:25

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

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Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#37 2018-08-20 12:10:11

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

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#40 2018-08-20 12:52:14

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Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#42 2018-08-20 13:06:02

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#43 2018-08-20 14:10:46

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#44 2018-08-20 14:23:33

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#45 2018-08-20 14:27:51

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#46 2018-08-20 14:32:27

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#47 2018-08-20 15:54:03

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#48 2018-08-20 23:37:02

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#49 2018-08-20 23:54:29

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

#50 2018-08-21 00:31:33

Re: Having Fun and Messing Around is NOT Griefing

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