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#51 2018-12-27 15:40:47

Stormyzabeast
Member
Registered: 2018-09-26
Posts: 150

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Jk Howling wrote:

is this really an issue though? There's not really such thing as an "infinitown" atm, because no town lasts forever. You're complaining and worrying about eves abusing the respawn function in order to have a town last forever- but right now, the longest a town tends to last is maybe.. 2-3 weeks at best. And a lineage, even one in such a town where they've got pretty much everything, rarely lasts beyond mid-20's.

Is this really a bad thing, or something to worry over? Such towns are novelties atm. There's rarely more than one or two known ones at any given time, and they don't last "infinitely" like you claim. Sure, in theory they could. But they don't. They never have and they never will. The eves get bored, or stop eve running, or eventually break their eve spawn chain. The city dies. Everyone moves on. But the memories it made live on.

There's also the novelty of being born into such a giant town. A massive, sprawling city, with outpost towns dotted around for miles, roads connecting it all, labelled and organized farms, even libraries. A lot of people don't like big city life. Even I'm not a huge fan of it. But the excitement of being born into a big town on occasion, one you recognize and had heard of before ever going there- it's a very fun break from the constant string of eve-camps and early towns you're usually stuck with!

I lived a couple lives in Goosetown before it died out. It was so exciting! I remember spending an entire life trying to teleport a child into the room so that they could unlock the door from the inside, as someone had blocked the outside with boxes. I remember exploring the road from end to end, ranging through the wilderness and stumbling upon forgotten outposts. I remember paying homage to our undying goose stump, and reading stories of past families in the library.

You're looking to take that away, for what? It might not be what you intended, but it's not like people are complaining. On the contrary, these rare and large towns are usually looked upon with excitement! There's a sense of pride and accomplishment in having a town go so far. A vast, VAST majority of eve camps simply die. We might reach gen 20, get sheep and compost and a decent forge and a small bakery. But it dies. They always do. And in most cases, that's the end.

But for the occasional town to outlive its first lineage, to grow and prosper.. that's a bad thing? It isn't in my eyes. Especially now that you have the option to lineage ban yourself from unfavorable scenarios. Everyone that might enjoy exploring such a large settlement can do so. People who don't can easily /die away and search for their preferred lives. There's little downside.


I don't know, all in all I just.. I don't see the issue. And I really don't want to lose the enjoyment I've gotten beforehand from being born to a large town that I recognize. The game would've long since stagnated for me without the occasional break from the constant push of eve camps and early towns.


Oh I loved goose town! I was the first woman who got trapped in the room by some guy! I had kids in there and people kept us alive. Someone (maybe you) tried teleporting my kids out but my daughter went rogue and killed me. She called it the human zoo lol. Fun times!! I was born into the city again some time later and the zoo was still going on. I finally convinced people that while interesting ( people in other towns talked about the "human zoo"), it was a waste of resources. They quit feeding them and it ended

Otherwise I agree completely. How are we ever to advance if all our old cities are wiped out? I hate that. I personally love starting Eve camps. If I'm born into a city, I help out until I'm older, explore, then take a bowl, stone axe and bow drill in a basket and head off into the wild to build my own camp


I am Eve Toadvine. I name my kids Alex, Jason, Jake, Holly and Disney characters. Forager and road builder extraordinaire!

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#52 2018-12-27 15:52:26

Tarr
Member
Registered: 2018-03-31
Posts: 1,546

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Stormyzabeast wrote:

Oh I loved goose town! I was the first woman who got trapped in the room by some guy! I had kids in there and people kept us alive. Someone (maybe you) tried teleporting my kids out but my daughter went rogue and killed me. She called it the human zoo lol. Fun times!! I was born into the city again some time later and the zoo was still going on. I finally convinced people that while interesting ( people in other towns talked about the "human zoo"), it was a waste of resources. They quit feeding them and it ended

Otherwise I agree completely. How are we ever to advance if all our old cities are wiped out? I hate that. I personally love starting Eve camps. If I'm born into a city, I help out until I'm older, explore, then take a bowl, stone axe and bow drill in a basket and head off into the wild to build my own camp

I was the one trying to teach people how to teleport their kids out of the zoo. Funniest 30 minute team building exercise I've ever seen between two people trying to put up and take down fence posts and put them in the correct order. Depending on exactly when you were born into the zoo is another thing too as I was the one who reopened the zoo by teleporting a willing child in when the zoo died off again.

Unfortunately, the zoo working to make a teleporter made the inside completely messy and by the time we could reopen I believe the door blocking issue had been fixed so the zoo wasn't really worth reopening if we could get them out easily.


Days peppers/onions/tomatoes left unfixed: 103

Do your part and remind Jason to fix these damn vegetables.

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#53 2018-12-27 16:28:05

CrazyEddie
Member
Registered: 2018-11-12
Posts: 676

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Gabby wrote:

I've been Eve-chaining in Server 9 for the last day, learning some recipes and experimenting with stuff that would be considered a "waste of resources" by experienced players. It was nice. I'll be sad to see this possibility go.

Run a private local server and you can experiment to your heart's content. If you're using Windows, it's easy!

That's all there is to it!

In the settings folder under the server folder, there are a bunch of configuration files that you can edit to control things like whether or not you randomly spawn, whether you always spawn in the same place, where exactly you spawn, etc. By default I believe you will always spawn in the same location, but if not you can edit the value in forceEveLocation.ini . You can also give yourself an extended lifespan by editing lifespanMultiplier.ini and/or epochSeconds.ini which might suit your purposes even better than Eve-chaining.

Thanks to Awbz for building and packaging the server for Windows.

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#54 2018-12-27 16:40:21

Gabby
Member
Registered: 2018-12-08
Posts: 32

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

CrazyEddie wrote:
Gabby wrote:

I've been Eve-chaining in Server 9 for the last day, learning some recipes and experimenting with stuff that would be considered a "waste of resources" by experienced players. It was nice. I'll be sad to see this possibility go.

Run a private local server and you can experiment to your heart's content. If you're using Windows, it's easy!

That's all there is to it!

In the settings folder under the server folder, there are a bunch of configuration files that you can edit to control things like whether or not you randomly spawn, whether you always spawn in the same place, where exactly you spawn, etc. By default I believe you will always spawn in the same location, but if not you can edit the value in forceEveLocation.ini . You can also give yourself an extended lifespan by editing lifespanMultiplier.ini and/or epochSeconds.ini which might suit your purposes even better than Eve-chaining.

Thanks to Awbz for building and packaging the server for Windows.

Wow nice, thanks! It will be great to have a place to train my clicks. I'm still really slow.


Be nice to the mouflon

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#55 2018-12-28 10:51:39

Three
Member
Registered: 2018-07-30
Posts: 47

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Jason since you are re-adding the apocalypse your point on why it should be removed is now redundant.


Uh yeah Jason didn't actually get his shit together
sooo
yeah

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#56 2018-12-28 11:22:09

Greep
Member
Registered: 2018-12-16
Posts: 289

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Gabby wrote:
CrazyEddie wrote:
Gabby wrote:

I've been Eve-chaining in Server 9 for the last day, learning some recipes and experimenting with stuff that would be considered a "waste of resources" by experienced players. It was nice. I'll be sad to see this possibility go.

Run a private local server and you can experiment to your heart's content. If you're using Windows, it's easy!

That's all there is to it!

In the settings folder under the server folder, there are a bunch of configuration files that you can edit to control things like whether or not you randomly spawn, whether you always spawn in the same place, where exactly you spawn, etc. By default I believe you will always spawn in the same location, but if not you can edit the value in forceEveLocation.ini . You can also give yourself an extended lifespan by editing lifespanMultiplier.ini and/or epochSeconds.ini which might suit your purposes even better than Eve-chaining.

Thanks to Awbz for building and packaging the server for Windows.

Wow nice, thanks! It will be great to have a place to train my clicks. I'm still really slow.

Practice server is really nice for this as well, as it's essentially this + godmode.


Likes sword based eve names.  Claymore, blades, sword.  Never understimate the blades!

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#57 2019-01-06 17:43:58

Tarr
Member
Registered: 2018-03-31
Posts: 1,546

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Now that I've started playing again all this change did was make being a city Eve more annoying. Previously you would live to sixty, die, then proceed to be spawned back to a new/same city.

Instead now what I'm doing is suicide until I spawn upon something that indicates people have been near (eggs, branches pulled, picked berries, etc) and walk until I find the camp/city nearby.

So what ended up getting fixed was being rewarded for good play and instead now it's just about dying your way into a village.


Days peppers/onions/tomatoes left unfixed: 103

Do your part and remind Jason to fix these damn vegetables.

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#58 2019-01-06 19:53:06

CrazyEddie
Member
Registered: 2018-11-12
Posts: 676

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Why are you trying to be a "city Eve" instead of simply being born into a city?

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#59 2019-02-14 13:30:07

stew
Member
Registered: 2019-02-13
Posts: 47

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

I just started an eve-camp on a low population server and I really want to go back there this evening. I could of course play on my own custom server.. However I like to have visitors/babies from time to time.

I personally think an advanced player should have the option to spawn as eve anyway (so he don't /die 20times and leaving bones in every city). But.. that is just me.

It's a bit complicated. Because I see the game is: You play 1 life in a community and then start a totally new life. However after playing it this way for some time you wanna focus on bigger projects, projects that can not finish in 1 life. So you kinda want to get back to the city where your project is. I think this should be possible (even thought its a bit against the idea of the game). If this is not possible I fear a lot of long time players will give up.

But.. how about the mainserver does not allow eve-chaining. But there is a 2ed "main" server where this is allowed?

One more thing: Most people feel connected to a city, not a bloodline. It would be cool if in the future we not just have the bloodline, but also the the city we were born in somehow tagged to our ingame-character. What if you could chose to spawn to the same city again? Or what if you needed to craft something to be able to spawn to the same city again?

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#60 2019-02-14 15:47:19

CrazyEddie
Member
Registered: 2018-11-12
Posts: 676

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

stew wrote:

It's a bit complicated. Because I see the game is: You play 1 life in a community and then start a totally new life. However after playing it this way for some time you wanna focus on bigger projects, projects that can not finish in 1 life. So you kinda want to get back to the city where your project is. I think this should be possible (even thought its a bit against the idea of the game).

You have answered your own question - it is against the idea of the game. It is directly counter to the idea of the game. Jason has on multiple occasions taken steps to prevent exactly what you are asking for. Jason does not want you to continue working on projects that take longer than one life; he wants you to leave a legacy and die, hoping that your descendants will continue where you left off but unable to know whether they will or not.

That is the entire game in a nutshell.

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#61 2019-02-14 17:39:41

CatX
Member
From: Norway
Registered: 2019-02-11
Posts: 438

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

I sort of wish people would have a greater say in the circumstances in which they were born, if only to reduce the amount of stillborns and baby suicides.

Someone pointed out that the apocalypses will wipe out everything anyway, so I can't imagine Eve chaining being a problem. If anything, I wish there was a button on the log in screen that allowed them to spawn in as Eve (and other options).

I can see how that too might defeat the purpose of the game... but even so, it seems to me that people will find a way to play the game as they want anyway.

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#62 2019-02-14 18:33:28

Peremptive
Member
Registered: 2019-02-14
Posts: 199

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

I think there is a lot of value to the current system on the depopulated servers. It is very rewarding to play on your own for a bit and the only way to really learn how to do everything in the game. Plus when griefers keep ruining your fun on the big server it is bliss to return to your own quiet village.


I really like in the OP the idea that any changes would apply if the server population is above some limit (say 40 people) so that this kind of play can be preserved.


I also think that if allowed, with more and more experienced players getting tired of griefing on the main server, the depopulated ones can offer some very interesting opportunities to keep people playing the game. I was reading  for example that on server 12 there is a large road connecting such towns,  making it possible to more easily find your way back if you get lost and creating a community.


If there are fertile women when you join, you could always play as their child if both didn't mind, and with something like a large connecting road, even visit your village later. If the mother is suspicious she can always not feed, or if the baby just wants to go to their eve spawn they can /die. So you can be with other players if you want and alone if you don't.



With the planes update, especially if the landing strips became permanent, someone could make a few of them and create a "town center" for the server so that if you are bored you can just fly there and talk with others.  Over time, you could add new items like a truck, that would allow for trade.


This game is a lot of fun when played collaboratively and the eve spawn mechanic helps in that regard outside of the main server.

Last edited by Peremptive (2019-02-14 18:34:31)

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#63 2019-02-14 21:49:53

artio
Member
Registered: 2018-12-18
Posts: 7

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

most of my time playing is on server 15 in an eve chain. i really love the solo play mechanic cuz it's my preferred way to play (building cities, libraries etc on my own)

i think this is a great mechanic for servers with a small population, but i can see how it could be 'abused' on larger servers.

if the eve chain only occurs on servers with limited fertile females & population, i think that would be for the best.

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#64 2019-02-15 17:16:00

Anandamide
Member
Registered: 2018-06-05
Posts: 142

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

CrazyEddie wrote:
Gabby wrote:

I've been Eve-chaining in Server 9 for the last day, learning some recipes and experimenting with stuff that would be considered a "waste of resources" by experienced players. It was nice. I'll be sad to see this possibility go.

Run a private local server and you can experiment to your heart's content. If you're using Windows, it's easy!

That's all there is to it!

In the settings folder under the server folder, there are a bunch of configuration files that you can edit to control things like whether or not you randomly spawn, whether you always spawn in the same place, where exactly you spawn, etc. By default I believe you will always spawn in the same location, but if not you can edit the value in forceEveLocation.ini . You can also give yourself an extended lifespan by editing lifespanMultiplier.ini and/or epochSeconds.ini which might suit your purposes even better than Eve-chaining.

Thanks to Awbz for building and packaging the server for Windows.

Hey so ive tried doing this with multiple different versions of the full download and on all of them, nothing happens after running runserver.bat, and if I just run the server exe, it says its waiting for a connection on port 8005 and then when I connect with the client the server crashes. What do lol?

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#65 2019-02-15 19:23:21

CrazyEddie
Member
Registered: 2018-11-12
Posts: 676

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Here's a thread where someone else had some similar issues: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=5247

Maybe that will help you figure out what's going wrong. You could also try contacting Awbz on Discord.

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#66 2020-01-05 09:22:00

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,520

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Jason,

Elsewhere you said this:

jasonrohrer wrote:

And somehow, I want the survival of your family to really matter to you NOW, in this life, and not based on benefits that are going to happen in future lives (like the ability to return to the same village and work on your own pet projects).  That particular part may be impossible, so I may have to bend the design a little bit... but I want your family to really matter to you, and I want you to prioritize its survival over the survival of other families, when push comes to shove.

Why?

Because such things will create interesting and varied stories.  There are already lots of interesting life stories coming out of the game, and I'm extremely proud of that fact, and I love those stories.  But I want MORE.  I want to turn that crazy/interesting story knob until it twists all the way off.  I want no two lives to ever be the same.  Not even a little bit the same.  Not even similar.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6087

First off, you simply can't have no two lives ever be the same, in the literal sense.  An Eve in the wild has the same sorts of things to do.  Your map doesn't have diverse initial starting conditions.  You gave up on multiple town types with respect to challenges basically when you did the temperature overhaul.  Everyone lives in the same cold areas these days, instead of navigating the differences between old-temperature type jungles, desert boundaries, and so on.  And you even made the map more similar all around when you went with topographic rings.  So what's relevant in the above?

The idea that lives end up as different as possible for players who vary their starting conditions as much as the game suggests.  Basically, one can imagine a theoretical player who has played a lot and never uses /die or intentionally dies in any manner.

Various town types existed under the old Eve chain mechanic.  A theoretical player would sometimes encounter a person Eve chaining and sometimes not.  Probably, there were differences in the stories in playing with towns where someone had Eve chained than in the ones where someone hadn't Eve chained.  Were there new types of stories that emerged because of the removal of Eve chaining in the high population context?  That seems extremely unlikely.  Thus, a significant effect of removing Eve chaining was that the number of possible stories for the aforementioned theoretical player decreased.

Really, you should have some system for players who can get reborn into the same spot if they live to 60 or have a high genetic score or something as a matter of choice.  It enables players who tolerate same-ness to play as they like.  But it also increases the number of story types for players looking for a diversity of story types since sometimes they will have the experience of interacting with players who don't choose their initial conditions at all and sometimes interact with players who do choose their initial conditions.


Danish Clinch.

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#67 2020-01-05 09:31:46

Gogo
Banned
Registered: 2019-10-11
Posts: 589

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

How long are roads on bigserver now? Do we have a map of towns?

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#68 2020-01-05 10:20:59

StrongForce
Member
Registered: 2018-03-09
Posts: 442

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

OMG Spoonwood
You want every one to read 3 pages of old posts?
Your comment isn't even that related to it.


Baby dance!!

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#69 2020-01-05 10:58:32

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,520

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

StrongForce wrote:

OMG Spoonwood
You want every one to read 3 pages of old posts?
Your comment isn't even that related to it.

No, I addressed my comments to Jason.  I also expect people to check the date and then make a decision about whether they want to keep reading or not.  Especially people like yourself who have seen me bump older threads for one reason or another.


Danish Clinch.

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#70 2020-01-05 18:33:43

DestinyCall
Member
Registered: 2018-12-08
Posts: 3,932

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

By now, you should also expect people to be very pissed off at you for necroing another old thread.   They have made it very clear how they feel about this method of getting Jason's attention and asked you multiple times to start a new thread when you have something new to add to a year old topic.

Not cool, my dude.  Not cool.

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#71 2020-01-05 19:08:13

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,520

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

My comment was addressed to Jason.  And it's better that discussions on such topis happen in public where anyone can read them and there's at least some level of accountability for Jason's decisions (not much I grant you) than elsewhere where only certain people can read them.

Also, I'm not going to expect people's emotional reactions, or at least not assume that someone I don't know will have one in particular.  Notice that Gogo asked questions here, which might have some relevance that I don't quite understand to the lack of Eve-chaining topic.

Additionally, note that Jason said that this was a question.  What's the question?  I'm not entirely sure.  Maybe old answers provide hints.  Though also, Jason says:

jasonrohrer wrote:

But the net result affects everyone, because the same villages are kept alive even after they die, removing the challenge of reaching higher tech or longer-term projects (like the bell tower).

In other words, the question was how would the net result of the Eve chaining change affect everyone?

I think I basically provided an answer to such by saying that it decreased the number of possible stories.  And the number of possible stories would probably increase if Jason went back with Eve-chaining or some other mechanic where at least some people (not all... griefers getting reborn into the same spot is dangerous) could get reborn into the same spot in the large population context.


Danish Clinch.

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#72 2020-01-05 19:54:16

DestinyCall
Member
Registered: 2018-12-08
Posts: 3,932

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

If you want to start a dialogue directly with Jason, it might be more effective to use his email, instead of resurrecting ancient threads.   I haven't seen him respond to any of your necros so far.

Albert Einstein is widely credited with saying, “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.”

Maybe you need to try a new approach, Spoon.

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#73 2020-01-05 20:14:49

Punkypal
Member
From: New Orleans
Registered: 2019-11-24
Posts: 245

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

I can see no reason for this thread to be necro'ed. What you are asking Jason isn't even really about the thread topic or even something said in THIS thread. You just picked a random dead topic and brought it back to the top to ask a random ass question you've asked like a dozen times.

Let me answer the question you keep asking. Yea, Jason said that once. He's said a lot of things. The game has evolved and changed and the way he is doing it right now doesn't allow a family to exist forever. HOPEFULLY he works some of the issues out and he can fix up some of the code so it becomes possible again. BUT FOR NOW that isn't a thing, so deal with it.

Seriously. I read that these forums are moderated by like 5 people? Did they all quit? Can Jason find a moderator to deal with Spoon? Maybe lock down dead threads at least?

Last edited by Punkypal (2020-01-05 20:15:36)


Daily Updated Map of Player Structures: https://bit.ly/2UrfOQ9
Link to Many Beginner Guides: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNp6g7 … xcw/videos
Composting Guide: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmgyl9evfhw
Diesel Engine Guide: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sMX_GlwgbA

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#74 2020-01-05 22:27:24

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,520

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

DestinyCall wrote:

If you want to start a dialogue directly with Jason, it might be more effective to use his email, instead of resurrecting ancient threads.

Perhaps it would.  It would also not have the advantage of having other people contribute to the discussion.  I'd rather open discussions.  Jason using private e-mails and special forums to discuss game development ideas is NOT a good call overall.


Danish Clinch.

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#75 2020-01-05 23:17:04

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,520

Re: Question about Eve spawn location "exploit"

Punkypal wrote:

Let me answer the question you keep asking. Yea, Jason said that once. He's said a lot of things. The game has evolved and changed and the way he is doing it right now doesn't allow a family to exist forever.

When Jason re-introduced the very large map he said that this was his expectation:

jasonrohrer wrote:

Eternal survival of one family will be possible through distant resource outposts and migration.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8320

Jason also said this a while back:

jasonrohrer wrote:

I'm also perplexed that there have been no extremely long or *even eternal family lines* [emphasis added... comment: this is actually more like a use of 'nor' than an 'or' if you know logical connectives] .  288 is the record, on a less-populated server, and 11 months ago.  The usual weekly record never tops 80.  That's 19 hours, and is impressive, but....  it's clear to me that it's just not important enough to anyone.  I envisioned people hopping on discord during desperate times and trying to recruit players to keep the flame burning through the night.

In response, in part, I had told him a long time before that death by lineage updates was a thing also:

Spoonwood wrote:

On top of that, that's only the line of descent numbers.  If you brought back Eve-chaining with more than four fertile females around (LostScholar has recently commented that he wishes such would come back: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/405487703), and added in each time the Eve reappears and has a new family, then those lineage numbers could end up longer.  Also, eternal family lines currently come as impossible as I understand it.  The update happens which requires that a server get completely emptied, thus necessitating the death of every family when the update comes.

He didn't respond to me by name, but unless I missed someone else he responded to my comment.  With a denial or by changing the question that he had posed:

jasonrohrer wrote:

Server reset is once a week, usually.  That can't be the reason that no family line has ever lasted more than 33 hours in recent times.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=5824

Jason also shows concern with family preservation here:

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8005

Jason also said this back in October during The Rift period:

jasonrohrer wrote:

Uno is giving the Boots legacy a run for their money.  Will bypass them by the end of the day.

Boots didn't get surpassed though on that ocassion. 

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8015

And you want me to just shut up about this?  NO, this is a longstanding issue.  Jason hasn't understood the problems there.  He even had trouble understanding what the problems were, because he dismissed lineage death by update as relevant and tried to distract from he raised as a question (what reasons is there to believe that a very, very long lineage would start on a Saturday or Sunday instead of on a Thursday or Friday?  There aren't compelling reasons).

On top of that I've come up with something that has some more potential in other threads.  Basically that some family member should have the ability to get reborn at some point in time by choice, re-start the the family as a quasi-Eve, and have that new family attached to the original family tree.

Isn't a thing?

There was lineage death by update this past week when the game updated.  And some other lineage no doubt died out due to no more than bad luck in the past week also.


Danish Clinch.

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