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#51 Re: Main Forum » What is currently the main reason families die? » 2020-05-18 17:30:20

DestinyCall wrote:

Lineages die out when they run out of people.   This can happen due to griefing, bad RNG, over-population, lack of critical resources, excessive SIDS, and poor choices.

But I think the main cause of lineage death right now is Jason.   Lineages die out earlier than they should as a direct result of design choices aimed at shortening lineage length and forcing reset.   Long lineages are discouraged because once we reach the end of the tech tree, the game stagnates.  The early game is about survival and building up your village. 
It has a clear purpose and a defined goal.  The late game struggles to find a new purpose or goal once raw survival has been achieved and core needs are met.   

Jason's solution is to avoid the end-game by encouraging early lineage death.   It keeps the game "fresh" by ensuring that we are always climbing upward without reaching the top of the mountain.   You can't get bored if you always die before reaching the end.

Good summary

#52 Re: Main Forum » Why I decide to quit this toxic game » 2020-05-18 07:35:27

Game is working as intended, it is just the playerbase delusion of something different. Get used to this.

#53 Re: Main Forum » Remove Posse » 2020-05-18 07:33:22

Alontae Balasa wrote:
Blue tinker wrote:

OOOH, that's my sign! It is my form of protest against the posse system as opposed to bobo's form of 'protest'. Took an entire life but it seems it was worth it if many people saw it. I will probably make another one soon, it was a lot of fun.

Of course feel free to make signs like this on your own, next time the gamedev logs in for a test life he will be surprised.

I like this form of protest. Much better than killing everyone you see and glorifying yourself.

Wait what? when did Bobin become a protester? does he make a statement of what does he protest for?

#54 Re: Main Forum » Gloves » 2020-05-18 07:31:24

Someone is just too afraid of Corona.

#55 Re: Main Forum » Build Cisterns: Economic Stability of Water Storage » 2020-05-18 00:05:57

Coconut Fruit wrote:

Isn't it a good idea? Would you prefer to spam many cisterns inside the town and block so much space?

I don´t know that´s on you, I was just answering your question because it shocked me that I genuinely couldn´t figure out a worst design.

Maybe if you put them in a 6x6 square with a closed area inside? Yeah that is worst. It can also be a solid 4x5 rectangle with 6 unaccesable cisterns inside.

#56 Re: Main Forum » Build Cisterns: Economic Stability of Water Storage » 2020-05-17 20:05:19

Legs wrote:

What would you all consider the optimal placement for cisterns then?

Personally I think they should be as close to the well as reasonably possible.

Close to the well obviously, you want to make the bucket transfer as fast and simple as possible. I mean at the very least one of your cisterns should be at two (or one gap) tile distance to allow the well to be emptied fast while spending kero. The others can be chain linked at one tile gap to allow the bucket transfer without moving your character.

#57 Re: Main Forum » Build Cisterns: Economic Stability of Water Storage » 2020-05-17 19:50:21

Coconut Fruit wrote:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ … _00_34.png

I made a little water storage place. How do you like it?

Seriously? I have trouble figuring out a worst design and location. For starters six of your cisterns can only be accessed from one tile. Second, it is completely out of place and third they form a wall. There should be a rule of never putting cisterns next to eachother.

#58 Re: Main Forum » New Iron System Boring; Old Iron System More Interesting » 2020-05-17 14:49:56

Coconut Fruit wrote:

It is boring to you because you don't play on bigserver2. Infinite iron would be more boring.

tocal wrote:

I would argue that the new system makes iron more abundant, not less.

True, we still have technically infinite iron, maybe not infinite but there is more of it than we need. And that is because we use dead families' veins. It's easy to find dead villages because of dry natural springs mechanics, and once we find a dead village, we just check east and west from the well if there is still an iron vein, in many cases there is at least one.

I love when people refute others just because of hate. New iron system is boring because every new Eve with a well site gets on average about 200 fresh iron over the map in a 400x400 square. Thats about 20 of the older veins. On a fixed grid. Not just that, because the new untapout feature allows for several primary locations in the same 400x400 square grid. If the Eves where not looking for perfect spots everytime we could fit 8 primary locations in the same square. Yes that would mean each 400x400 square of the map could produce about 1600 iron.

Somewhere I alredy said that hungry work is boring because it is grindy. It just adds a food constrain but nothing interesting out of it. But it is not the worst mechanic to blame, the old system with hungry work would still be more insteresting. So yeah spoon is totally right.

#59 Re: Main Forum » How to make Roads and Railroads more useful? » 2020-05-17 02:59:51

pein wrote:

flat rocks got different uses so there is a conflict

abandoned towns only good before Newcomen phase

if cars would work only on top of the roads, but wouldn't require (this much) kerosene, then they would be decently useful
but now they can be taken apart and then the engine destroyed so that isn't a good thing either

mine carts would need levers to stop them anywhere on the line to allow gradual scavenging with them, maybe auto load and unload feature so they not just a meme

Flat rocks and even round stones are boring and tedious to collect. The civilized way was the use of a quarry to make more instead of randomly collecting them. We can make stone blocks but can´t use the big dug rocks for anything else. It desert lock doesn´t help either, because a lot of stones and flatties are located there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otiO_wKCwEc

#60 Re: Main Forum » How Iron Works Now: The Whole Process » 2020-05-17 02:39:24

Alterior wrote:
testo wrote:

Also a small hint, each time you recycle iron and steel you are basically doubling your iron/steel supply so each iron number can be hypothetically doubled.

It takes two broken tools to get one scrap iron. Use two iron tools, get one free.
So, 50% extra is free as a rough estimate.
Shears cost two iron to make but break into half a scrap, which brings it under a perfect 50% (shears are bullshit Jason).

I hope you understand now why each time you recycle a broken tool you double the overall steel supply. You may not be doubling the steel from that specific broken tool, you get just half steel from a broken tool. But by making the recycle process iteratively over the same piece of original steel you get double out of it.

#61 Re: Main Forum » How Iron Works Now: The Whole Process » 2020-05-16 12:18:05

And just to throw in why you get double iron by recycling steel let me put it this way:

You start with some steel ingots, lets say 64. And make tools then use them and manage to recycle them all into scrap steel. So you get your 64 steel value plus 32 scrap that can be turned into steel again. Hey that´s only 1.5 steel. Yep, but once you use those you get again 16 scrap steel. And after use 8. And then 4, 2 and last 1 steel. At this point you can´t make more scrap steel. But you got the value of 64+32+16+8+4+2+1=127 steel. Which just happens to be about 2x64. If you know a little math about sums you understand why is it double every time.

#62 Re: Main Forum » How Iron Works Now: The Whole Process » 2020-05-16 10:57:51

Oh well I will just drop a few things on each step:

0 Yes veins can only be found once per family with your FIRST well location (made with ten stones at a natural spring -not dry-). However, there are several abandoned veins at second and third level around the map. I would say half the families don´t use all the iron they get from the map.

1 Muddy iron veins are placed in the same 40x40 grid of springs, which means you have theoretically the positions at +40, +80, +120 and 160 as possible muddy veins to become loose (east) and those at the left (West). Those are in total max 8 veins to access with your well. Jason did a survey on the map and average per well is 3 veins per natural spring. There are places with zero. If you happen to make your well site at a spring with zero and didn´t check, you can still make a well site somewhere else for a second time only limited offer and still get iron from there.

If you want to know the ideal number I´d say 3 is pretty ok and 4 is more than enough. You are getting 8 loose iron with no work, 20 average from open vein and 46 average from stanchion kit from each mine. A total of 74 iron from each vein without kerosene. If you are in an average spot you get 3x74=222 iron total which is why most families don´t even use all the iron. The pick use is relatively low, each one is 21 uses so you need about 3 picks per mine.

2 Whenever you loosen up your muddy veins by collecting your 10 stones in at your well site, go east and west before making the well and take the four iron from each by hand. If you don´t, you will lose those loose four iron because the mine will turn into an iron vein once the well is made, giving you four more 4 loose iron each. Check https://onetech.info/3954-Iron-Vein-justDried for clarification.

3) Iron is unlimited if you have kerosene, but you get only 5 iron per kero bowl (It is 6 iron -1 a NEW chisel). A full tank of kero is 6 charges so you get 30 iron from each tank. Each oil rig has an average of 11 uses. Check https://onetech.info/2311-Firing-Oil-Pumpjack.
So, if you use your diesel into iron you get about 11 tanks or 66 charges or 330 iron for the full oil rig. Compared to the average iron you get it is about the same amount of a spring with 4 iron veins. But the real problem is water, not iron. A shallow well is about 1.3 cisterns and a deep well about 3.3 cisterns. Without rubber you can get an average of 4.3 cisterns. With rubber alone you can get 12 cisterns of water. Past that you need oil. And oil is about 2.3 cisterns per tank (give or take). If you have to choose, kero should always go into water imo.

Also a small hint, each time you recycle iron and steel you are basically doubling your iron/steel supply so each iron number can be hypothetically doubled.

This is not a guide tbh, but everything is based on the actual numbers.

#63 Re: Main Forum » How Iron Works Now: The Whole Process » 2020-05-16 06:46:56

tocal wrote:

Does it matter the state of the chisel? can almost broken chisels be used as the bit?

Could you also explain the spring system? how things dry up, the directional markers, sand, why eves can't create well sites anywhere near where they spawn oftentimes? smile

I was making a full post with explanations and a picture until I realized I was doing Jasons work. For free. I can still explain it to you on discord.

#64 Re: Main Forum » Yet another successful genocide, players don't know posse » 2020-05-15 09:24:56

Just to point out that the problem is still not bobo but the awkward posse and curse mechanic.

For starters, restrict the kill command based on memescore. Lock up the kill command to the top 20% or 30% of players. Oh snap... it is not so easy to kill your own family then since you would be lowering your own memescore. Wait, that would make memescore actually meaningful Mmm...

But we all know that is not going to happen. Afterall domestic boars, pitbulls and bears are in the game for a reason. Have you ever wondered why you can pick the boar piglet and it also goes in a backpack without decay? Mmm...

#65 Re: News » Update: In Perpetuity » 2020-05-13 08:24:59

Nah Bobo is ok, kid is only using whatever tools he has to have his fun. Obviously he doesn´t give a crap about "parenting and civilization building" and he gets off by knowing that he is "known". You can blame him all you want, but at the end of the day he is not responsible for terrible mechanics and poor desing: majority rule in a game with obvious comunication issues? Yeah np. Player skill cap because no combat mechanic but kill action based on followers? Yeah good idea. Bobo is just a blessing for Jason, brings free drama and spice to a game that otherwise doesn´t have the "struggle.

#66 Re: Main Forum » Central highway? » 2020-05-13 07:55:33

Hey Morty, someones looking for you. Make a big ass road so we can lose even more horses.

#67 Re: Main Forum » Dry natural well sites and eve » 2020-05-12 21:24:15

You can take abandoned wells but won´t get iron out of them afaik. Only east and west work. Next time just run west until you find untouched land.

#68 Re: Main Forum » Dry natural well sites and eve » 2020-05-12 19:22:17

Arcurus wrote:

another stupid question. i doent get it with the iron...
there is a "Sunken Iron Vein" how to get iron from it. its very close to the family well...

You collect 10 stones and put them in a natural spring. They become well site which allows you to take the iron from the sunken veins (4 apiece) that are exactly in the same ley line of your well (up to 160 tiles). Once you collect those normally 4/12 iron you can get steel to make hammer/shovel. With shovel you upgrade your well site to shallow well which makes the iron veins uncover to use the mining pick. This only works for your primary family well or second if you made a well site with no sunken veins in the same ley line. If you have sunken veins Not in the same line of your well  they won´t ever uncover with the well you used. Come on this is pretty intuitive.

#69 Re: Main Forum » Suggestion: Different Seasons - not always the sun is shining lovely » 2020-05-12 09:10:06

Jamie wrote:
testo wrote:

Haha, so cute. People making suggestions and even agreeing on them.


Can't tell if you are happy or just being condescending, Please clarify.

Happy ofc smile

#70 Re: Main Forum » Suggestion: Different Seasons - not always the sun is shining lovely » 2020-05-12 06:22:18

Haha, so cute. People making suggestions and even agreeing on them.

#71 Re: Main Forum » Late Game Town Yum Survival List » 2020-05-11 22:05:05

Also I agree with Pein´s main idea:

Lets say you reach 20 yum in your lifetime (with some insulation thats a decent yum level to keep you alive up to 60). If you ate literally any food that is at least 4 bites per bowl of water that means you used a grand total of 5 bowls of water and 5 bowls of soil.

By looking at the most efficient foods you are bypassing how hard is it to make and the tools needed. Chips are not that good in that regard because you need coals/shears just to make more than one of it. I would be eating roasted rabbit or baked potato any day instead of chips. In the time I take to make tortilla chips I can better go get a cart with 4/8 buckets of water or an oil tank.

Almost any food is decent if you are yumming. Cooked beans is the big exception but even then, If I go get a bucket of rubber for the newcomen and get 12 buckets of water out of it can you really say I wasn´t efficient?

#72 Re: Main Forum » Late Game Town Yum Survival List » 2020-05-11 13:32:58

Just to point out a few misconceptions:

a) Shucked ear of corn is not bad if you are yumming. As long as you reach 16 yum with it is worth it and it is by far one of the easiest foods to get.
b) Carnitas is super good food with or without yum. Tacos are better? Sure, but you need to make them and you are still going to get a surplus of pork meat anyways. Cook those damn pork stakes.
c) Mutton and mutton pie should be always cooked with or without yum because almost every town has a big surplus. Make food that otherwise is going to be a waste of space, same as carnitas.
d) Labeling three sisters stew as very hard is... I will not make this comment.
e) Labeling burrito as very hard...
f) Labeling mushroom as exotic food...
g) Baked potato is ok while yumming.

#74 Re: Main Forum » OHOL fanart » 2020-05-03 10:06:11

I also believe your work is getting better everytime. Not like the first drawings weren´t nice, but you can clearly see how you feel more confident each time. Jesus and Sachiel is really, really good my favorite so far.

#75 Re: Main Forum » OHOL fanart » 2020-05-03 01:18:30

Amazing work. I love the expressions. <3

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