Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

JonySky · 2020-06-15 16:01:56

Dodge wrote:

The_Anabaptist wrote:
You want better?
How about this then: Whatever special biome your Eve chooses to settle in is what the family is allowed to interact in and if she chooses one of the more generic ones, you are out of luck for the desert, arctic & jungle.
The system as it exists is inherently racist. The removal of it isn't politically correct, it is just the right thing to do if you believe all races can perform the same basic tasks as depicted in the game. Anyone who argues otherwise is a racist in my book. Skin tones should be so that everyone feels included in the game, not used as stereotypes of race x is good at y.
The_Anabaptist
And what if no Eve's chooses desert for example then you cant get sulfur, bad idea.
Black people dont get as easily sunburnt as gingers or other white people, does that mean that biology is racist?
It's not really about performing tasks since everyone can make latex if they have the ingredients, it's about evolution and adaptation to a particular environment.
Black people dont get heatstroke in the desert that's accurate to real life (to a certain degree) nothing racist with that.
Main issue imo is in the fact that it's a pure restriction instead of an advantage in adaptation over others.

Dark skin is better able to withstand radiation than white skin ... ... but there are also white people who withstand the heat of the Sun better than other white people.

Genetics has nothing to do with racism
Racism is created by people, not by genetics, nor by nature.

Ahhh ... When you talk about blacks not getting heat stroke in the desert ... not true, everyone can get heat stroke in the desert (even dying) if you don't protect yourself properly

Returning to the game:
OHOL has been created in an improvised way, without clear objectives, without clear ideas ... Racism is one of its results

Jason can turn all the OHOL characters into robots, this makes more sense with the effectiveness of which many players talk so much in this forum and the problems with races are over.

Last edited by JonySky (2020-06-15 16:07:52)

DestinyCall · 2020-06-15 16:19:51

Coconut Fruit wrote:

I would even say this game is anti-racist. It encourages multiracial interactions, help and love

I used to feel that way about OHOL. Back when I first started playing, I was really impressed by the diversity of character models and the randomized nature of character generation. You might be a black baby born to a brown mother and your sister might be white. It was kind of weird and funny, but also quite endearing. Sometimes it would lead to uncomfortable situations, like when you were the only very dark-skinned person in a large village and someone would decide to make an off-color joke. But even that was sort of a good thing, since it gave insight into how stupid and hurtful racism based on skin color really is.

Unfortunately, the game has gone through many changes since that time. Separating skin tones by family, so other families "look different" was the first step down the path to where we are now. Then came the language update and the war update. The goal was to keep families distinct from each other - instead of merging into one big happy multi-racial family. Racial specializations was another step down that path and also the most overtly racist. The homelands update finally accomplished the goal of preventing multi-family melting pot towns completely.

So much for the happy days where all skin colors were equal and everyone could live together as one family. I miss old OHOL.

Coconut Fruit wrote:

I wonder what Jason thinks about all these racism accusations.

I'm pretty sure he thinks petty human morality does not apply to gods.

Last edited by DestinyCall (2020-06-15 16:20:14)

Dodge · 2020-06-15 16:22:42

JonySky wrote:

Ahhh ... When you talk about blacks not getting heat stroke in the desert ... not true, everyone can get heat stroke in the desert (even dying) if you don't protect yourself properly

That's why i said to a certain degree, as a black person you are more adapted to an environment with scorching sun over a white person, so pretty much like in the game, nothing racist with that.

DestinyCall · 2020-06-15 18:25:34

Dodge wrote:

JonySky wrote:
Ahhh ... When you talk about blacks not getting heat stroke in the desert ... not true, everyone can get heat stroke in the desert (even dying) if you don't protect yourself properly
That's why i said to a certain degree, as a black person you are more adapted to an environment with scorching sun over a white person, so pretty much like in the game, nothing racist with that.

And next you will be talking about how women are physically weaker than men, so it is perfectly reasonable to favor men in positions that require physical strength. Nothing sexist about that, right? It is just biology.

This kind of thinking has been used to justify all kinds of bullshit over the years, by dressing up prejudice as fact.

Caiaphus Tarwater · 2020-06-15 18:26:08

Dodge wrote:

Black people dont get as easily sunburnt as gingers or other white people, does that mean that biology is racist?

Biology is science. The fact that darker skinned people have more melanin in their skin (which makes their skin darker) and are therefore less susceptible to sunburn proves what... that people with more melanin are less susceptible to sunburn. Ask a biologist about current research on "races" of humans, and they will tell you that there is no biologically definable "race." Please look up "race" on Wikipedia to get started on this important topic.

Racism is not only about supremacy, although that is usually in the mix or follows hard on. Racism begins with 1.) the fiction of race itself and then proceeds 2.) to declare that different races have different inherent abilities.

Some here seem to believe that there really are objective categories like white and black and yellow that we can neatly fit all people into. That is simply not true and as we understand more about genetics we understand that more and more.

Perform your own thought experiment: If races are real, then how many are there? Do "Jews" get their own race, or are they "Semites" with the Arabs? Is a darker skinned person from southern India "white" while a lighter skinned person from Africa is "black"? Are Latinos "white"? Do we lump the Polynesians in with the Chinese? If so, why? On what objective, scientific bases could such decisions be made?

Race is a social and cultural construct with an ancient and murderous human history. In other words, people have chosen to make meaning out of the superficial differences they see, and then they have used those meanings to advance their own agendas. The "black experience" or the "white experience" today is real, but it is not based on biology but rather on historical social/cultural/political/economic realities that have resulted from the perpetuated fiction of racism.

This game, which is played by some young and impressionable people, is currently perpetuating that racist fiction.

Dodge · 2020-06-15 19:12:56

DestinyCall wrote:

Dodge wrote:
JonySky wrote:
Ahhh ... When you talk about blacks not getting heat stroke in the desert ... not true, everyone can get heat stroke in the desert (even dying) if you don't protect yourself properly
That's why i said to a certain degree, as a black person you are more adapted to an environment with scorching sun over a white person, so pretty much like in the game, nothing racist with that.
And next you will be talking about how women are physically weaker than men, so it is perfectly reasonable to favor men in positions that require physical strength. Nothing sexist about that, right? It is just biology.
This kind of thinking has been used to justify all kinds of bullshit over the years, by dressing up prejudice as fact.

Yes men are physically stronger on average and women usually are better at endurance/cardio what's the problem?

If a job requires physical strength on high priority then you favor someone strong be it a man or a woman.

But if you want 100% equality then fuck children and woman first, if the titanic sinks i take the lifeboat and let you freeze in the cold water.

Also the game is sexist because men cant give birth to babies, jason pls fix!!!

Anyway having black people being more comfortable in the desert compared to whites and browns is not racist at all and if you think it is i really dont know what to tell you, travel the world, see how things work instead of being brainwashed by the media.

Some real world events suck but it's not a reason to stop thinking for yourself and change the wrong things for the sake of giving an impression of meaningful change.

Reminds of these brands that try to cater to everything happenning just to sell more of their shit, like pretending to care about gender issues to sell more razors by making crappy commercials.

That being said i still think the way this update is done is not good especially the annoying dropsy mechanic.

Caiaphus Tarwater · 2020-06-15 20:39:27

Dodge wrote:

Anyway having black people being more comfortable in the desert compared to whites and browns is not racist at all....

Most of the world's darker skinned people do not live in desert environments, and most people who live in desert environments are not "black" (by the racial fictions employed in the USA at least).

You, therefore, have no objective basis to say that "black people" are "more comfortable in the desert." If you think I'm wrong, hit me with some science and prove it and I'll apologize.

Skin color is... skin color. When you take that skin color and start applying made-up ideas about what that skin color means, then you are being racist in the classic sense.

The_Anabaptist · 2020-06-15 22:36:16

Dodge wrote:

The_Anabaptist wrote:
You want better?
How about this then: Whatever special biome your Eve chooses to settle in is what the family is allowed to interact in and if she chooses one of the more generic ones, you are out of luck for the desert, arctic & jungle.
The system as it exists is inherently racist. The removal of it isn't politically correct, it is just the right thing to do if you believe all races can perform the same basic tasks as depicted in the game. Anyone who argues otherwise is a racist in my book. Skin tones should be so that everyone feels included in the game, not used as stereotypes of race x is good at y.
The_Anabaptist
And what if no Eve's chooses desert for example then you cant get sulfur, bad idea.
Black people dont get as easily sunburnt as gingers or other white people, does that mean that biology is racist?
It's not really about performing tasks since everyone can make latex if they have the ingredients, it's about evolution and adaptation to a particular environment.
Black people dont get heatstroke in the desert that's accurate to real life (to a certain degree) nothing racist with that.
Main issue imo is in the fact that it's a pure restriction instead of an advantage in adaptation over others.

Well for one, we could have more Eves than we do now, that could mitigate the problem you propose. And it makes more sense for scaling the game upward, assuming we ever have a net player base gain again. OR Smart Eves would evolve with the meta and learn not to all plop their camps on the grasslands. My bet is on the Smart Eves. If it proves too much of a problem to overcome, an Eve could be given a notice of the filled ecological niches when they are created in order to encourage them to find the right Biomes.

The_Anabaptist

Spoonwood · 2020-06-15 23:39:32

DestinyCall wrote:

Dodge wrote:
JonySky wrote:
Ahhh ... When you talk about blacks not getting heat stroke in the desert ... not true, everyone can get heat stroke in the desert (even dying) if you don't protect yourself properly
That's why i said to a certain degree, as a black person you are more adapted to an environment with scorching sun over a white person, so pretty much like in the game, nothing racist with that.
And next you will be talking about how women are physically weaker than men, so it is perfectly reasonable to favor men in positions that require physical strength. Nothing sexist about that, right? It is just biology.

The differences between the sexes are greater than differences between races. With respect to what you said, it depends what you're talking about. If you're talking about two people a priori applying for a job position, then thinking about women being physically weaker than men as a rule of thumb, is sexist, because it treats an individual as if they were a member of a group on the basis of sex. If you're talking about the distribution of people in positions in a profession, then you aren't talking about individuals, you're talking about a group. And it makes senses that more men than women will be in positions that require more physical strength, because of the differences between the sexes. Were it the case that women had the same numbers as men in some professions can be sexist against men and in favor of women, because more qualified men than women had applied for those jobs and got rejected, or would have applied if not for discriminatory job advertising.

The problem often enough is lack of seeing individuals as individuals. That doesn't always apply though, such as if you want to know why the distribution of people in certain positions is a certain way.

MistressZues · 2020-06-16 01:07:11

Gogo wrote:

Racism is idea that some races are better, therefore they should rule, conquer and wipe out others. But every races in OHOL has limitations, there are no supreme ones. People confuse racism with race characteristics.

Yes which is why I don't care if specialty is still a thing but the separation of it. telling us we cant live with them because they aren't our family is segregation.

MistressZues · 2021-01-04 17:37:08

Dodge wrote:

My personnal favorite solution would be to have a realistic map so not infinite and with some biomes separated by oceans, this would solve the issue of travel, multiracial village etc.
Since the biomes would be way far appart even separated by natural barriers like oceans having multi racial villages would not be an issue, you would have to travel and even make outpost and distant cities either way.
So you would trade with other cities depending on their surrounding biomes and not necessarly trade with other races.
This would also solve the issue with iron since it would be naturally limited by the map not being infinite so the weird current iron system could be removed aswell.

. YES, JASON PLEASE MAKE OCEANS, MAKE RAFTS, BOATS, AND SHIPS! MAKE BIOMES SEPARATED BY "CONTINENTS"!! such a good solution.

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#26 2020-06-15 16:01:56

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#27 2020-06-15 16:19:51

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#28 2020-06-15 16:22:42

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#29 2020-06-15 18:25:34

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#30 2020-06-15 18:26:08

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#31 2020-06-15 19:12:56

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#32 2020-06-15 20:39:27

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#33 2020-06-15 22:36:16

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#34 2020-06-15 23:39:32

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#35 2020-06-16 01:07:11

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

#36 2021-01-04 17:37:08

Re: Where is the love? Can we end the segregation!? Please?!

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