A Subject Name Relevant To The Game

Morti · 2020-04-05 17:24:36

Shh, the mods will never suspect this is just a chance for me to share a cool Youtube channel with you that is, loosely, relevant to what we do in the game.
It's someone I've watched about 10 hours of in the last 3 days. His channel is called "Bertram - Craft and Wilderness"

I don't know what it is about this guy and his videos, he's like, a more Nordic, Primitive Technology, except he smiles while he works, and poses for the camera, like Fabio on a California beach, in December. The man, is a fucking charm, and I'm not gay, but if he asked, well, I wouldn't say no, right away. XD

OK, laughs out of my system, this channel is really good. Just as I said, it's like Primitive Tech, which you have probably seen before, but,for some reason, I wasn't suggested this channel, ever, until just a few days ago.

When he whipped out these bellows, I instantly thought of the game, and how our rabbit pouch bellows are itty bitty little things made from a single rabbit's pelt.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3u3DDSHJ1M

But then, after tiring of Youtube's recommendations, I went right to his channel and looked at the uploads, and, after watching the most recent video, my iron jaw dropped.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjqFst-53qk

Just look at that thing!

And it's not just that, there are nearly a hundred videos on this channel. some with millions of views... where has this channel been!?
I watch American, Canadian, Russian, even English and Australian survival channels. People making log cabins in Norway, people making bamboo treeforts in the Philippines, I thought I'd seen just about every survival, bushcraft, outdoor, crafting, camping channel, in every country, on every subject. But I had yet to see Bertram.

Also, since I suddenly realize I'm being too serious and a laugh, here's a good video on stones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=remr6Na_hD8

But really, just take the time to watch some of Bertram's videos. I don't care if you reply to this post or not, just, do yourself a favor and admire the time and effort Bertram has put into his work. It's just a bonus if you're a girl or gay, he's just a handsome guy, on top of everything else.

Even his least viewed video, where he's making those steel wedges you put in the ends of tool shafts, to keep the heads from coming off, is a pretty nice look inside a more modern blacksmith's studio.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgKdzPBF1B0

Good stuff, don't miss this guy's work.
Stay sane. Enjoy reality.

jinbaili83 · 2020-04-05 18:48:14

Thanks for sharing the video link Morti.
Unfortunately they left me craving smoked fish and I only had sprat and herring in oil.

Spoonwood · 2020-04-05 19:54:16

Morti wrote:

But really, just take the time to watch some of Bertram's videos.

And Bertram learns how to use many, many tools in what surely seems like less than 60 years of time. Because nature, unlike some people, does not resent people learning how to use tools that they have not used before. Nor does nature resent people making use of their capacities for learning.

Elsayal · 2020-04-05 20:49:39

Guess what, reality is different from a game !
Amazing right ?

Spoonwood · 2020-04-05 20:56:05

Elsayal wrote:

Guess what, reality is different from a game !
Amazing right ?

No, I don't find anything amazing here.

And that the game is *less* kind to people than nature is with respect to their abilities, consists of how little value the game has overall. People don't play games to feel like they are less capable than they are in real life. And a game that gets purported as art suggesting that people believe false ideas about their own nature is not a good one. Art that suggests that people are lesser than they are, is not worthy of the name.

Last edited by Spoonwood (2020-04-05 20:56:52)

Elsayal · 2020-04-05 21:01:42

Spoonwood wrote:

People don't play games to feel like they are less capable than they are in real life. Art that suggests that people are lesser than they are, is not worthy of the name.

Yep.
And I'm sure you can make an engine in real life.

Spoonwood · 2020-04-05 21:16:57

Spoonwood wrote:

People don't play games to feel like they are less capable than they are in real life. Art that suggests that people are lesser than they are, is not worthy of the name.

Elsayal wrote:

Yep.

Elsayal wrote:

And I'm sure you can make an engine in real life.

I don't believe that for a moment I would become less capable of making an engine in the real world because of the number of other people in the world.

I also don't believe that for a moment by doing other things, without injury, that I would thereby become less capable of making an engine in the real world.

I don't believe, for example, that if some man cuts down two trees, that man becomes less able to make an engine in the real world.

I also don't believe that if a man or woman uses 10 tools 2 times, that man or woman becomes unable to make an engine, because of using 10 tools and the number of people in the world.

Elsayal · 2020-04-05 21:29:48

You change the point I was pointing out when you first said : "People don't play games to feel like they are less capable than they are in real life."
So don't use it as a starting point of arguing if then you change the angle. Now your talking about people being there and low pop server. Like if it can make any sense outside of a game.

Instead of stating that you were wrong you just change subject. So yeah, we can't move on with this, do you understand ?

For instance :
In real life, you don't become bones instantly when your die.
Therefore this game suck.

Games have nothing to do with real life. You don't like a game, just don't play it, no one is forcing you.

So for your new shitty point I could said things like :
In real life, you need someone to help you out to make an engine. You can't do it all by yourself.
In real life, you can't be a high level sportsman, a high level scientist, a politician and a baker.

Anyway, limitations in this game are there to make cooperation a thing, do you got that ?

You just don't like an update, we got it. But arguing like you do is bullshit. And when you are obviously wrong, you just change the subject.

Legs · 2020-04-05 21:51:38

Polymaths do exist in the real world. There really are some people that can do it all.

Jonny Kim for example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonny_Kim
Navy SEAL, astronaut and medical doctor.

Or maybe Ken Jeong:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Jeong
Doctor, actor and stand-up comedian.

There are lots of these people in the world. Multi-classing is completely possible.

I can work summers on my uncle's farm for a few years when I'm young. When I get bigger I can start handling livestock. After highschool maybe I get a job in a bakery for a few years. Take night classes and get a job machining. Take that experience and start working in an auto shop. Hey, you know what, with some hard work and learning I could probably even build an engine myself from scratch- after having a half dozen other jobs before that. It's not that unreasonable.

How many jobs have you had so far in your life? Have you ever gone hunting with your uncle or that one redneck friend? Maybe you stayed the night and started a campfire? Ever taken down a tree piece by piece with a ladder, a rope and a rented chainsaw? Baked some home made bread for the family thanksgiving? Does doing any of that mean you can't still do the other stuff too?

Spoonwood · 2020-04-05 21:56:05

Elsayal wrote:

You change the point I was pointing out when you first said : "People don't play games to feel like they are less capable than they are in real life."
So don't use it as a starting point of arguing if then you change the angle. Now your talking about people being there and low pop server. Like if it can make any sense outside of a game.
Instead of stating that you were wrong you just change subject. So yeah, we can't move on with this, do you understand ?

Alright, so you came in here responding to my comment, not the other way around.

I also don't think you were trying to make a point. I think you were trying to insult me, basically in hopes that I would become demotivated to write.

Elsayal wrote:

For instance :
In real life, you don't become bones instantly when your die.
Therefore this game suck.

I wouldn't disagree with that line of thinking if someone said it in earnest. I also don't think you've made clear what you've given an instance of.

Elsayal wrote:

Games have nothing to do with real life.

There exist plenty of games that either come as inspired by real life situations or scenarios, or have parts based on them. So, enough games do have *something* to do with real life.

Elsayal wrote:

You don't like a game, just don't play it, no one is forcing you.

You aren't entitled to a world where people never say anything critical of a game.

Elsayal wrote:

In real life, you need someone to help you out to make an engine. You can't do it all by yourself.

This relates to a game making characters *less* capable than people are in the real world how?

Elsayal wrote:

In real life, you can't be a high level sportsman, a high level scientist, a politician and a baker.

This relates to a game making characters *less* capable than people are in the real world how?

Elsayal wrote:

Anyway, limitations in this game are there to make cooperation a thing, do you got that ?

I don't think you read the reasons for tool based restrictions. Also, tool based restrictions lead to people cooking pies at the oven together less often. On top of that, so what if they were about cooperation? Cooperation isn't always good. It's often better to do things in private or by oneself instead of cooperating, because then one understands one's abilities better AND one learns more. One also improves more, since one has to do things their self instead of relying on other people. Cooperation is sometimes better than doing things independently, but sometimes not better than doing things independently.

And at the end of the day tool based restrictions still make it so that the player characters have less capability than people do in the real world in that people in the real world don't have limits on how many different tools they can learn to use over time, unless they die, or lack cognitive capacity. A man does not become dumber by learning how to use an axe. If anything he becomes MORE capable of learning how to use other tools, since he knows how to use his muscles in ways that he previously probably had not practiced.

Elsayal · 2020-04-05 22:00:27

@Legs

But how many of them did an engine by themselves only ?
0,1 % ? Maybe less, maybe no one. Or, they can be the fittest, with a lot of tools slots.

So I we follow your road about LIFE = GAME, maybe it should be impossible for someone to do an engine by himself in game, right ?

Or this other one : you don't tame a horse by giving him a carrot in real life, so maybe we should'n t be able to do it in game, right ?
Or this other one : you can't ride a horse like a pro just because it got a saddle, so maybe we should'nt be able to ride a horse. Or it should use a tool slot, right ? Like an ability.

Anyway, don't mix real life and game mechanics, it doesn't make any sense.

@Spoonwood :

Spoonwood wrote:

I also don't think you were trying to make a point.

I was : the point was game are not reality.

Last edited by Elsayal (2020-04-05 22:04:03)

Spoonwood · 2020-04-05 22:15:35

Elsayal wrote:

So I we follow your road about LIFE = GAME

I don't think Legs anywhere claimed that life and the game are the same.

Elsayal wrote:

maybe it should be impossible for someone to do an engine by himself in game, right ?

No. The game should be completely playable by one person. Single-player mode should also be fully compatible with multiplayer mode.

Elsayal wrote:

Anyway, don't mix real life and game mechanics, it doesn't make any sense.

I suspect that phrases like this get trotted out when people don't want to think about games in the larger context of real life.

Elsayal wrote:

I was : the point was game are not reality.

I don't believe I've ever claimed anywhere that the game was life, nor that life was the game also.

It still stands that the game has a viewpoint of humans in the future as less than they are in the real world today in that their capabilities have decreased.

Player characters do NOT have the knowledge of how to hold objects in deserts, jungles, or tundras with enough people in the world, even though WE know how to do such in the world today no matter how many people are alive on Earth.

And player characters do NOT have the knowledge of how to use some objects after a certain number of uses of other objects even though WE know how to such in the world today no matter people are alive on Earth.

This is supposed to be art, and a vision of humanity's future? But the characters are less capable than we are. Such isn't art. It's just uninspiring crap.

Legs · 2020-04-05 22:16:37

Elsayal wrote:

Anyway, don't mix real life and game mechanics, it doesn't make any sense.

I agree. The game mechanics don't make any sense. They're based on the logic that you can't do everything yourself. That learning to do something is a lifetime commitment. It's not unless you choose to make it a lifetime commitment.

Are there people that spend their life chopping down trees? Yes. Do we strictly NEED them to chop down a given tree? No. You can do it yourself if you want to and you know how. Same thing with baking. Bakers exist, sure. They're great when you just want some bread and don't want to bake. That doesn't mean you need to make a lifetime commitment to bake something yourself. Do farmers exist? Yes, obviously. So do home gardens. Etc.

The point is that it should only be a commitment if you choose to make it one. If you want to be a farmer or a baker or a lumberjack: great! If you just want to do something a few times, that's great too. There's no reason that we should be forced to use our time in a way we don't want to. That's a hamfisted and unrealistic mechanic trying to push people into committing to things when they don't necessarily want to. It's stupid and misguided from the very start, and the only way to tolerate it is by grinding enough score that the system no longer affects you.

Elsayal · 2020-04-06 02:51:49

@Spoon : You continue to mix real life and game, making reference to real life when it's about game mechanics, Spoonge. At this point, you are just dishonest in exchanging argument, It doesn't make sense or interest me whatsoever.

@Legs :

Are there people that spend their life chopping down trees? Yes. Do we strictly NEED them to chop down a given tree? No. You can do it yourself if you want to and you know how. Same thing with baking. Bakers exist, sure. They're great when you just want some bread and don't want to bake. That doesn't mean you need to make a lifetime commitment to bake something yourself. Do farmers exist? Yes, obviously. So do home gardens. Etc.

Please don't make reference to real life. It doesn't make any sense.

Regarding the game mechanics now, you are right : you don't need anyone to chop down a given tree. You can do it once
For the farming, you can plant whatever you like in this game, it will not cost you anything.

You can even, Bake, Chop tree, and still have 3 slots left. It's not if you got only one slot each life.

The point is that it should only be a commitment if you choose to make it one. If you want to be a farmer or a baker or a lumberjack: great! If you just want to do something a few times, that's great too. There's no reason that we should be forced to use our time in a way we don't want to. That's a hamfisted and unrealistic mechanic trying to push people into committing to things when they don't necessarily want to. It's stupid and misguided from the very start, and the only way to tolerate it is by grinding enough score that the system no longer affects you.

Again, in One hour one life you can Farm, bake and be a lumberjack if you like. In a single life. So... Yeah.

Spoonwood · 2020-04-06 03:54:11

Elsayal wrote:

You continue to mix real life and game, making reference to real life when it's about game mechanics, Spoonge. At this point, you are just dishonest in exchanging argument, It doesn't make sense or interest me whatsoever.

I'm pretty sure that statements like the following do NOT mix real life and the game. In other words, they do NOT confuse the two or put them into one category:

Spoonwood wrote:

Player characters do NOT have the knowledge of how to hold objects in deserts, jungles, or tundras with enough people in the world, even though WE know how to do such in the world today no matter how many people are alive on Earth.
And player characters do NOT have the knowledge of how to use some objects after a certain number of uses of other objects even though WE know how to such in the world today no matter people are alive on Earth.
This is supposed to be art, and a vision of humanity's future? But the characters are less capable than we are. Such isn't art. It's just uninspiring crap.

Elsayal wrote:

Please don't make reference to real life. It doesn't make any sense.

It does make sense to refer to real life as Legs did, because it reveals how real life is better than the game, and it suggests to people that they keep a handle on real life.

If you want people around here to turn a blind eye to real life, your honesty can sincerely get doubted.

FishRfriendsnotfood · 2020-04-06 04:38:49

play the game of Life....it will blow your mind.

DestinyCall · 2020-04-06 07:24:32

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

play the game of Life....it will blow your mind.

Ehh, I'm not a fan of rogue-like games. I prefer to play games that have a robust save system.

Elsayal · 2020-04-06 08:15:44

Yes spoongebob, just continue to play on words like a 5 years old, it suit you well.

You can't compare how real life works and how a game works. It doesn't make any sense to say that if this happens irl then it should happen that way in game. So you mix them. And you continue to be dishonest and un-logic.
At this point, whatever you can say, you have be beaten on the logic field but you are too proud (or too stupid ?) to admit it.

Farewell in your fantasy mind.

By the way, sorry Morti, we have butchered your nice thread :'(

Spoonwood · 2020-04-06 15:58:03

First off, it's Spoonwood.

Elsayal wrote:

You can't compare how real life works and how a game works.

Such comparisons have already gotten made by myself and by others. Whatever has gotten done can get done. So, I can compare how real life works and a game works.

I don't mix them. I keep the game and real life distinct.

Also, had it been the case that I, Spoonwood, had gotten "beaten on the logic field", Elsayal would have had some sort of refutation of what I said that involved reasoning. Elsayal puts forth dogmatic assertion and denial, and even goes so far to deny that some things can happen which have already happened.

Elsayal · 2020-04-06 16:47:16

You continue to play on words, kiddo.
Too bad you didn't read and write the second sentence !
I guess it's your sausage way of thinking you love so much.

Last edited by Elsayal (2020-04-06 17:00:52)

Spoonwood · 2020-04-06 18:49:43

Elsayal wrote:

You continue to play on words, kiddo.
Too bad you didn't read and write the second sentence !
I guess it's your sausage way of thinking you love so much.

1. I'm probably older than you believe I am.

2. I don't think it hard to figure out that "sausage way of thinking" is an insult on the basis of my sex.

3. You clearly aren't engaging in further analysis or counter-argument. You're just exclaiming, trying to make insults, and otherwise posturing. Usually when people do that, their position doesn't have much to back it up.

Elsayal · 2020-04-06 19:16:49

You still didn't mention my second sentence. Lil Kiddo.

FishRfriendsnotfood · 2020-04-06 20:05:55

be careful Elsayal, spoon likes to play victim and get people banned from the forum. A forum for a game he claims to not play, he could ask for a refund. Spoon also has had no relevant information or suggestions so I'm not sure why people continually engage with him. It gets no where and devolves to the point that he will take the word 'the' and argue semantics.
Don't stress yourself out about his bullshit.

Spoonwood · 2020-04-06 21:29:46

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

be careful Elsayal, spoon likes to play victim and get people banned from the forum.

Fish, I do not think it an understatement to say that Elsayal has insulted me personally several times.

Also, I've given you my hash before and here it is again: 9a0589cb673446fd534812d43cde1913f30b256a I've only ever had one account. You are welcome to check and see how often I've played. Also, with respect to refunds, there's the matter of other people and their concerns, and where I bought the game from. People should be warned when something is bad that that something is bad.

And apparently you merely wish to dismiss what suggestions and information that I have provided by your say so. Simply put, things aren't that simple.

Elsayal · 2020-04-06 21:39:04

Elsayal wrote:

You still didn't mention my second sentence. Lil Kiddo.

One Hour One Life Forums

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A Subject Name Relevant To The Game

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