Lineages Might Last Longer If Killing Was Impossible/Pesistent IDs

Spoonwood · 2020-01-09 04:28:33

It's possible to pack up and move on a large map, so griefing is less likely to be effective at destroying lineages if killing were removed.

Also, given that griefing destroys lineages or decreases their length a lot, introduction of persistent identifications might increase lineage length.

Villas · 2020-01-09 17:40:53

If killing is impossible, what do we do when our cousin Smithy Heaven (http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768370) builds an adobe wall far from town and starts to waste all the town’s water on that wall? Or if Bobby Heaven (http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768348) breaks the ovens and forges and hides bellows, plenty of tools, buckets, pies God knows where with an upgraded horse cart? It actually happened yesterday, but I was a countess, exiled them and gave an order, a lot of people targeted them at the same time and even with the horse they couldn’t escape. In that town we had lot of pads and aprons, I taught my daughters the medical way and we healed some people that life (people were fighting because of crowns), they followed me because of that and for my pie deliveries.

So will lineages last longer if the griefers can’t be killed? I know that that person would receive some curses, but they can be born in another town and grief for another whole hour without being stopped. Imagine thieves from another family, stealing every single thing knowing they can’t be stopped.

Believe or not, I don’t think the problem is killing, but not killing. Griefers kill a lot and that’s bad, but new players or I don’t know, kind people, are afraid of killing for some reason, so they let the griefer alive and let the task of killing the griefer to another person, and then that griefer kill again and again and again until the lineage is vanished. At least from my perspective, it’s what is happening, generally I have to deal with them, because everyone, but veterans, is afraid of having bloody hands. I have a lot of examples.

Yesterday I was born in a town, my mother Mya Bytheway (http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768675) had a bloody bow and shot the last girl (actually I was the last girl, she thought I would starve), but suddenly an old man from another family fed me and my uncle stabbed her. I stayed alive, no one cursed her and I was a baby. Before she died, she said she killed 6 families that day. Indeed, she almost killed ours, but someone killed her and I think that guy was a veteran because he was very skilled. My mother was killing everyone before I was born, we had pads and weapons, no one killed her neither healed the victims until my uncle came, if it wasn’t him, the family would be gone forever.
I had four daughters and forgot to curse my mother, I’m sure she came back as Jessica Bytheway. Jessica shot her sister, I didn’t have a knife, but two choices: kill Jessica before the cooldown ends or try to find a knife and heal my daughter letting Jessica escape. I chose kill Jessica, since I knew my other daughter Salvatora took the only knife available, Salvatora came, I said “heal Athena!”, but Salvatora simply left and kept working on the sheep pen, I think she didn’t even know what was happening, If I haven’t killed Jessica, I’m sure Salvatora would be the next victim. Our family lived for 10 more generations (descendants of Salvatora’s). If she had healed Athena, we could’ve lived longer.

But if anyone had killed and cursed Mya after she shot the first fertile girl, none of that would happen, also people could have saved every victim, since we had loads of pads.
We can make killing innocents “impossible” if we heal them, while letting the griefers die. But what happens is that no one heals, no one kills the griefer and the griefer ends up killing everyone. I witnessed more family extinctions that I would like to.

In another life Curstin Max (http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5740238) was causing problems since she was a baby, she took a bow as soon as she could, I was too old to chase her and when I tried to kill her, her mother told me to stop even after I explained everything, I told her sisters to kill her, gave them knives. As soon as I died of old age, Curstin came back to town and killed her mother, her siblings and her children, she literally killed the family since her babies were the last generation to live (78), I cursed her and she cursed me, I couldn’t go back there anyway.

If people had joined me and killed her, none of that would happen, also we had pads in town (two bowls), they didn’t heal each other and ended up dying.Curstin left the town because she knew I was the only one disposed to have bloody hands there, I would heal her victim (since I had knife, pads and thread in my inventory) and quickly kill her, while others weren’t giving a shit.

Again, if people healed innocent and helped kill the griefer, the family would last much longer.
Trust the hardworking people, I always trust the ones I see working hard, between me (an old woman who worked her whole life) and a quiet ten years old with a bow, trust the old woman. I use that tactic, and as far as I’m concerned I always trust the right people.

As you can see, from my perspective the problem is: people aren’t killing griefers while griefers are killing everyone. Also we have loads of pads while no one heals. If one single person kill the griefer while the murder is slow and curse them, while another one heal the victim, problem solved, the griefer is gone at least until the one who curses them is alive.
People, don’t be afraid of having bloody hands if it’s for a good cause (since it’s the only way to deal with crimes, we can’t jail nor sue criminals), don’t let griefers alive, join the ones disposed to kill them and always heal victim and curse the griefer. Trust hardworking people, don’t trust that teenager who was never even watered a single berry bush.

DestinyCall · 2020-01-09 18:16:22

Killing just leads to more killing. We need a way to deal with the players who are griefing that is more persistent that just killing them in ONE life. Killing their character might end the threat in our village, but it just pushes the griefer player off onto some other village and gives them a new identity so they can try again. And again. And again.

That's why you end up dealing with griefers almost every life. It is not because there are dozens of griefers. It is because every village keeps playing "hot potato" with the obvious griefers.

testo · 2020-01-09 19:21:28

DestinyCall wrote:

Killing just leads to more killing. We need a way to deal with the players who are griefing that is more persistent that just killing them in ONE life. Killing their character might end the threat in our village, but it just pushes the griefer player off onto some other village and gives them a new identity so they can try again. And again. And again.
That's why you end up dealing with griefers almost every life. It is not because there are dozens of griefers. It is because every village keeps playing "hot potato" with the obvious griefers.

Which is why cursed should be a permanent state. Whenever I curse a player I don´t want to play with him ever again, I don´t want to be related to him/her in the game. It is not that hard, people grief because literally they will be back in five minutes.

Spoonwood · 2020-01-09 20:08:36

Villas wrote:

If killing is impossible, what do we do when our cousin Smithy Heaven (http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768370) builds an adobe wall far from town and starts to waste all the town’s water on that wall?

Migrate away from that person and curse them.

Your example also I find poor. Smithy lived 50 years. The lineage lasted 33 more generations after him: http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768370. So, I don't think Smithy as bad of an individual as he may have been, was as destructive as you think.

Booby is potentially a better example. But again, curse and migrate away from that person.

Villas wrote:

I know that that person would receive some curses, but they can be born in another town and grief for another whole hour without being stopped.

That happens when they killed also.

Villas wrote:

Imagine thieves from another family, stealing every single thing knowing they can’t be stopped.

Yea, again migrate. They'll be focused on stealing before you start running. Players run at the same speed, and they probably won't know which direction to chase you. If they chase you on a horse or horsecart, hypothetically, as soon as they jump off, you jump on, and then get away even faster.

Villas wrote:

Believe or not, I don’t think the problem is killing, but not killing.

Are you serious? Warswords existed as 'butter knives' and The Rift existed. No, you're wrong.

Villas wrote:

My mother was killing everyone before I was born, we had pads and weapons, no one killed her neither healed the victims until my uncle came, if it wasn’t him, the family would be gone forever.

The family died out 16 hours ago. It's gone forever: http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768675 (always click on the Eve to check and see if a family still exists or not... you should get the same link as I posted if you click on the Eve in the family tree).

Villas wrote:

In another life Curstin Max (http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5740238) was causing problems since she was a baby, she took a bow as soon as she could, I was too old to chase her and when I tried to kill her, ...

Thanks for the example. So if one player killing another with a weapon didn't exist, then Curstin takes the bow and tries to kill people. And fails probably more than once. She's then just someone standing around being non-productive and not a threat. You wouldn't have to worry about someone like Curstin grabbing a bow and arrow, because they would be harmless. None of the other deaths would have happened without killing in the game.

Cantface · 2020-01-09 20:20:14

Migrating ALL THE TIME is just NOT manageable and you should know that Spoon. If killing was gone we'd be absolutely screwed because one griefer without any way to take them out can and will destroy a timeline. Imagine towns with multiple griefers doing their thing all over the map with NO WAY to stop them. Even if you move you'll give birth to a griefer or your children will or one could discover you easy and you want us to just keep running? A horrid game of cat and mouse forever?
Hell no please and thank you!

Spoonwood · 2020-01-09 20:53:40

Cantface wrote:

Migrating ALL THE TIME is just NOT manageable and you should know that Spoon.

Uh, how much have you tried that? Lineages are already expected to migrate once local oil and local water runs out, if lineages last long enough to do that (do they? I don't know).

Cantface wrote:

If killing was gone we'd be absolutely screwed because one griefer without any way to take them out can and will destroy a timeline. Imagine towns with multiple griefers doing their thing all over the map with NO WAY to stop them.

There's far more wild areas than towns on the map.

Cantface wrote:

Even if you move you'll give birth to a griefer or your children will or one could discover you easy and you want us to just keep running?

There's no indefinitely sustainable water supply to make food, and local wild food regeneration isn't fast enough to sustain too many people. Sure, keep on running in such a situation. The game isn't set up for towns to be self-sustainable, so why object to running?

Cantface wrote:

A horrid game of cat and mouse forever?

Cats eat mice. They also have to be able to track mice. Do you really think that griefers could track you if you ran a lot? And how would they harm you without the ability to kill you directly out in the wild? By bears? But they would be chasing you, and your character is faster than bears.

Cantface · 2020-01-09 21:09:16

I'm just saying, this is not a foolproof plan that will have zero consequences attached to it. People founded groups during apocalypse and rift, I can imagine a "no killing" griefer squad would be quite an annoyance to handle.

You should only migrate if you HAVE to because of resources, (which happens regularly enough)not because of griefing otherwise they just keep winning and we'll keep losing. I and many people would not be happy with no kill mechanics and I am willing to bet people will kick up a fuss about it, so much so that they will just abuse the system till killing will have to be turned back on. It's happened before with rift and apocalypse and would happen again if no kill is implemented. I'm just telling you now, it's obvious.

Last edited by Cantface (2020-01-09 21:12:42)

Villas · 2020-01-09 22:13:48

Cantface wrote:

Migrating ALL THE TIME is just NOT manageable and you should know that Spoon. If killing was gone we'd be absolutely screwed because one griefer without any way to take them out can and will destroy a timeline. Imagine towns with multiple griefers doing their thing all over the map with NO WAY to stop them. Even if you move you'll give birth to a griefer or your children will or one could discover you easy and you want us to just keep running? A horrid game of cat and mouse forever?
Hell no please and thank you!

Exactly, I won't abandon my town and my family because of a griefer, I will kill and curse him no matter what. Migrating in fun sometimes, but not every life. And I'm not a mice, I'm a lion, the griefers have to run away from me, not the opposite. I spent my last life building the biggest building I've ever made, made with stone and even the floor had some cut stones on it and cousin took the horse cart and all rubber we had and ran away. She came back years later with empty horse trying to take a shovel, I quickly took the horse and put it far east, when I came back people were chasing her, since everyone were aware of what she had done.
If someone goes to a neighborhood and starts to mess with people, breaking stuff, stealing, locking, hiding things or even disturbing people that person will die or be jailed, I doubt the entire town will run away and migrate to another place.

The major problem with griefers isn't even killing. Of course killing is bad, but when they kill we CAN kill the griefer and heal the victims, the problem is that we DON'T do that, people don't give a shit for grievers, let them be and they kill one by one. But the biggest issue is that they can hide things faraway, waste all water on adobe walls or even hiding full water buckets, break tools, lock buildings. I won't abandon the building I spent almost an hour making, because someone decided to mess with my family, when the resources ran out it's ok, but we had a new comen and a lot of rubber that Twisted brought to us while streaming today, I wont migrate because a person decided to steal everything. I want to be able to kill them, if I can't kill them then the only option is migrating or just stop playing because it wouldn't be funny at all have to run for griefers instead of defeating them.

Cantface · 2020-01-10 00:16:38

I agree with you Villas, on pretty much everything especially about the biggest problem being the resource hoarding, destroying tools, wasting steel/water/rubber and pretty much anything lol. Horses, Trees, Bears, farming/seeds, kiln/oven/building breaking/locks and hidden keys, sheep, cows etc etc I imagine anything and everything that could be abused would be tenfold. We need to be able to kill and that's facts.

Also I usually don't like online multiplayer games with PvP, partly because I suck at them and partly because I just don't enjoy the experience in general. In THIS game though even I understand murder is necessary, the combat 'system' is whack and not difficult to pull off for anyone which is the point. We have slowdown and alerts now so be thankful for that.

三(ᕕ ಠ益ಠ)-¤=[]:::::>"✧"<:::::[]=¤-(⊙⊱⊙ ᕗ)三

Whatever · 2020-01-10 10:05:39

Villas here are stats about the players you mentioned in your post https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 880#p85880

==========================================
Date 2018_04_01 - 2020_01_09
==========================================

==========================================
SMITHY HEAVEN http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768370
------------------------------------------
firstEntry: Thu, 18 Apr 2019 19:17:29 GMT
lastEntry: Thu, 09 Jan 2020 17:50:38 GMT
------------------------------------------
timeAlive: 995.01h
------------------------------------------
avg. death age: 36.34
Death by hunger: 912 -> 55.34%
Death by oldAge: 641 -> 38.90%
Death by killer: 93 -> 5.64%
Death by disconnect: 2 -> 0.12%
------------------------------------------
born as eve: 108 -> 3.16%
------------------------------------------
kids: 2852
kids per female life: 3.22
avg. kid lifespan: 16.46
------------------------------------------
kills: 50 -> 3.03%
avg. victim age: 26.01
victim female probability: 54.00%
==========================================

==========================================
BOBBY HEAVEN http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768348
------------------------------------------
firstEntry: Sun, 05 Jan 2020 01:09:11 GMT
lastEntry: Thu, 09 Jan 2020 23:49:08 GMT
------------------------------------------
timeAlive: 34.07h
------------------------------------------
avg. death age: 27.10
Death by killer: 25 -> 34.25%
Death by hunger: 38 -> 52.05%
Death by oldAge: 10 -> 13.70%
------------------------------------------
born as eve: 15 -> 5.21%
------------------------------------------
kids: 79
kids per female life: 1.61
avg. kid lifespan: 18.38
------------------------------------------
kills: 36 -> 49.32%
avg. victim age: 30.19
victim female probability: 80.56%
==========================================

==========================================
MYA BYTHEWAY http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5768675
------------------------------------------
firstEntry: Thu, 26 Dec 2019 05:39:24 GMT
lastEntry: Thu, 09 Jan 2020 23:49:08 GMT
------------------------------------------
timeAlive: 97.95h
------------------------------------------
avg. death age: 25.79
Death by hunger: 140 -> 59.32%
Death by killer: 77 -> 32.63%
Death by oldAge: 19 -> 8.05%
------------------------------------------
born as eve: 130 -> 18.34%
------------------------------------------
kids: 268
kids per female life: 1.57
avg. kid lifespan: 14.80
------------------------------------------
kills: 107 -> 45.34%
avg. victim age: 29.07
victim female probability: 59.81%
==========================================

==========================================
CURSTIN MAX http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=5740238
------------------------------------------
firstEntry: Sat, 14 Dec 2019 16:12:40 GMT
lastEntry: Tue, 07 Jan 2020 21:14:19 GMT
------------------------------------------
timeAlive: 44.73h
------------------------------------------
avg. death age: 25.19
Death by hunger: 58 -> 54.21%
Death by killer: 38 -> 35.51%
Death by disconnect: 1 -> 0.93%
Death by oldAge: 10 -> 9.35%
------------------------------------------
born as eve: 20 -> 13.99%
------------------------------------------
kids: 119
kids per female life: 1.68
avg. kid lifespan: 10.42
------------------------------------------
kills: 71 -> 66.36%
avg. victim age: 27.54
victim female probability: 61.97%
==========================================

link to how i made the stats: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=5607

Spoonwood · 2020-01-10 10:35:21

Compared to the 'death by killer' numbers from those posted month ago, most of those griefers have a high 'death by killer' rate.

Someone had to have killed them.

Whatever · 2020-01-10 11:15:50

Yes, high death by killer percentage is and indication for grief.

You can see the first stats from SMITHY HEAVEN are very different to the other 3 stats.
SMITHY HEAVEN has played 1000 hours and only has a 5.64% death by killer,
the other three have played much less, started playing 1 month ago and have over 30% death by killer.
Also their kills are around 50% which is high.

I dont think SMITHY HEAVEN is a heavy griefer but the other 3 definitely are

Cantface · 2020-01-10 14:07:43

Ooh I forgot about these nifty stats! It's a shame I'll never be able to figure out how to see mine but it's probably for the best anyway, I'd have like a non existent eve score lmao

Villas · 2020-01-10 14:41:01

Whatever wrote:

Yes, high death by killer percentage is and indication for grief.
You can see the first stats from SMITHY HEAVEN are very different to the other 3 stats.
SMITHY HEAVEN has played 1000 hours and only has a 5.64% death by killer,
the other three have played much less, started playing 1 month ago and have over 30% death by killer.
Also their kills are around 50% which is high.
I dont think SMITHY HEAVEN is a heavy griefer but the other 3 definitely are

That's also a thing, we have heavy griefers and people who are griefing just a town for a specific reason.
Smithy Heaven didn't do anything wrong until his 30-something, when I saw he building and adobe wall next to a maple tree, then he brought a water bucket and a bowl and wasted it all on the wall, he went back to town and I stole the bowl on the floor. I told that to my daughter and could use the ORDER system to warn my followers. Three people followed me, and everyone saw he bringing a full water bucket and then he ran a lot. He died after my death, because when I was born there, he was running to hide his body behind a tree after someone stabbed him. He probably had a reason, may be didn't like the town, someone pissed him or whatnot. Smithy started griefing when he was old around 37 years, while the others were griefing since they were 3 or as soon as they could get a weapon.

Wuatduhf · 2020-01-10 14:45:10

DestinyCall wrote:

We need a way to deal with the players who are griefing that is more persistent that just killing them in ONE life. Killing their character might end the threat in our village, but it just pushes the griefer player off onto some other village and gives them a new identity so they can try again. And again. And again.
That's why you end up dealing with griefers almost every life. It is not because there are dozens of griefers. It is because every village keeps playing "hot potato" with the obvious griefers.

I mean....I'm just sitting here with my suggestions on what bigger towns need to curb Griefers'/troublemakers' spawning locations.

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2020-01-09 04:28:33

Lineages Might Last Longer If Killing Was Impossible/Pesistent IDs

#2 2020-01-09 17:40:53

Re: Lineages Might Last Longer If Killing Was Impossible/Pesistent IDs

#3 2020-01-09 18:16:22

Re: Lineages Might Last Longer If Killing Was Impossible/Pesistent IDs

#4 2020-01-09 19:21:28

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#5 2020-01-09 20:08:36

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#9 2020-01-09 22:13:48

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#10 2020-01-10 00:16:38

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#11 2020-01-10 10:05:39

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#12 2020-01-10 10:35:21

Re: Lineages Might Last Longer If Killing Was Impossible/Pesistent IDs

#13 2020-01-10 11:15:50

Re: Lineages Might Last Longer If Killing Was Impossible/Pesistent IDs

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#15 2020-01-10 14:41:01

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