Jason PLZ - next necessity

breezeknight · 2019-03-24 07:57:54

stackable meat

rabbits
mutton
pork

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breezeknight · 2019-03-24 07:58:55

before the stackable carrot update the OHOL towns were a junk yard, the situation improved after to a mess, so that's a big plus
a small change with a H U G E impact !!!

since the temp update clothing is THE most important part of OHOL life, aligned with food
before that update were skinned rabbits a nuissance but not as urgent, since barely anybody ever made clothing
now in EVERY town & even earliest settlements hunted rabbits are the norm, hence skinned rabbits start to litter the surface in a similar way as farmed non-stackable carrots were

the situation with non-stackable mutton remains about as urgent as before
the newest in game development is, baskets upon baskets of grouped mutton, next to grouped rabbits are cluttering bakeries, literally
the more people present in a town, the more urgent the situation
this produces as a result lack of baskets, since those are used to group meat

pork just comes along

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Tarr · 2019-03-24 09:45:06

No.

Instead of asking Jason for everything in this game to stack ask Jason to add the next level of containers. If everything in this game stacks there will never be a reason to add another level of containers after the basket/boxes. Instead of saying Jason please make X, Y, Z stackable Jason should give us the next level of containers finally after so long. It took 134 versions of the game before we got the first and only upgrade to the large containers (box was v36, cart with tires was v170 and the only upgrade to small containers has been baskets to backpacks which were both in v20 of the game.

Add shelves to be late game box replacements (holds six to eight small containers) and add sacks to be basket replacements. This means let game tech = more storage = more reason to do late game tech.

Last edited by Tarr (2019-03-24 16:15:35)

Glassius · 2019-03-24 11:03:52

Why can't we have both, stackable meats and containers?

voy178 · 2019-03-24 11:19:21

Maybe make a rabbit recipe that allows it to be cooked in the oven rather than over hot coals? Also, one that doesn't necessarily ends in a mess like rabbit bones do. Or should we utilise trash pits more often?

breezeknight · 2019-03-24 11:33:01

if you want to have containers, then ask for containers

i am asking Jason to do what in my opinion is useful

if you think differently, then go ahead, ask for what you need
i won't be posting obstructionist views

learn to be tolerant

secondly

the current situation in the game looks like it will take a very long time to be able to make any sort of containers in a useful manner
atm milkweed is rare, reed is rare, wheat is problematic, wood is problematic
there are too many gaps & too many stopgaps to make any further containers viable in the everyday average settlement
will that situtation change cause there are related updates then i might be asking for containers
atm, nope

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Last edited by breezeknight (2019-03-24 11:33:22)

Tarr · 2019-03-24 13:32:49

Glassius wrote:

Why can't we have both, stackable meats and containers?

Because whenever he actually cares to add a next tier of storage it has to be power creeped to meet or be better than the stacks or it'll be DoA. Sure, it's a nice QoL update to make a bunch of stacks but it eventually defeats the point of ever wanting to put another storage upgrade in the game. If meat stacks what items are you actively going to put into storage containers? Pies and tool heads. You could upgrade to a box + baskets to increase meat per tile from six to twelve but why do that when you could just make two piles of meat for free? The next small storage upgrade would end up just being ignored because all the items in the game stack, they only get used to increase item movement from A to B where items get stacked in the second area, or the cost ends up being too high vs just stacking something.

I'm not against adding improvements to cleaning up towns but I'd rather see things improved because of us using the tech tree instead of piling all our problems and moving them somewhere else.

breezeknight wrote:

the current situation in the game looks like it will take a very long time to be able to make any sort of containers in a useful manner
atm milkweed is rare, reed is rare, wheat is problematic, wood is problematic
there are too many gaps & too many stopgaps to make any further containers viable in the everyday average settlement
will that situtation change cause there are related updates then i might be asking for containers
atm, nope
- - -

You explicitly act like he hasn't added one off items to the game before that only serve a purpose in producing one recipe or item. Salt, worms, newcomen drill, light bulb, loom, pigs, candles, steel spring, etc. The point is if something is missing to make a container either through the item not existing yet or the parts not being there he can just add it like he does with all the random things he adds in content weeks. The games tech tree is wide but obviously not very deep. Don't have linen for bags? He can just add flax into the mix for the week so bolts of linen cloth become craftable. No screws to make a shelf or bookcase? Add a way to craft screws that week.

If something isn't there he'll add whatever is missing to make the item in the week he makes something.

breezeknight · 2019-03-24 15:14:20

the carrot stacking improved the quality of life tremendously

i would like to have that quality expanded to meat as well

all argumentations against are just unreasonable obstructions

InSpace · 2019-03-24 15:27:05

stack cartz

Tarr · 2019-03-24 15:32:21

And the carrot issue was compounded by many different factors.

-If you left carrot seeds seeding they would delete the soil. This made it so you either had to have a cluster of carrot seeds all over the ground because they weren't able to be stored in anything reasonably or plant them in more soil rows.
-New people overwater the carrots for whatever reason. I'm not sure why people feel like they need to water every single row of dry carrot seeds but this has been an issue ever since I've started playing. Since carrot spare carrot seeds were stored in the dirt they would get watered leading to either massive fields of carrots or carrot seeds due to people not wanting to pick sixty carrots.

So because of lack of reasonable containers for seeds, the seed having to be picked or going to waste, and people mass watering carrots it led to the issue of massive carrot production which has never ever been needed except when we pretty much only ate carrots. If carrots had been made a bit more reasonable earlier I feel like we wouldn't have even needed stacking carrots tbh.

With meat I would go so far as to say you shouldn't even be allowed to put it on the ground after harvesting it from the sheep/rabbit. Since this meat is both free byproducts of composting/clothing it might as well have some drawback such as it decaying if left out for too long or repeatedly dropped on the ground.

Make the convenience come from tech not more random piles.

breezeknight · 2019-03-24 15:44:28

you can do with tech
i prefer simplicity, especially in a scrambling settment, where people have difficulties to even get their necessities together
nobody has any time, most even don't have the knowledge to do any tech

i see in many towns cars, planes, radios, kerosene pumps & their parts standing dry & useless while there is often not even fire, no kindling, the last axe is nearly broken, all carpentry tools are scattered, people chop down mango trees to get wood !!!

so, just wake up to the reality of OHOL
it's not tech tree, it's basic chaos

you can wish for a complex technology, but that's not the reality

piled up meat is one option, one option which would aleviate the situation now & everywhere
we are far from living in OHOL anything resembling actual civilization, with piled meat we could at least organize the chaos a little better

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Booklat1 · 2019-03-24 16:09:55

Tarr wrote:

No.
Instead of asking Jason for everything in this game to stack ask Jason to add the next level of containers. If everything in this game stacks there will never be a reason to add another level of containers after the basket/boxes. Instead of saying Jason please make X, Y, Z stackable Jason should give us the next level of containers finally after so long. It took 134 versions of the game before we got the first and only upgrade to the large containers (box was v36, cart with tires was v170 and the only upgrade to small containers has been baskets to backpacks which were both in v20 of the game.
Add shelves to be late game box replacements (holds six to eight small containers) and addshacks to be basket replacements. This means let game tech = more storage = more reason to do late game tech.

nahhh, better to make everything OP and nerf shovels again to balance it out. Why create actual by design oportunities to expand the techtree?

Anandamide · 2019-03-24 17:19:18

You could do both and still have both be worth it though. Meat could be only slightly stackble, say 3 rabbits or two mutton, but you could fit 4 mutton in reg box/cart, 6 in upgraded cart, and say 8 in the hypothetical upgraded large storage. having two boxes next to an oven, and some more boxes around the perimiter of the bakery already provide tons of storage, so any future storage update will need to be tech locked in some way, maybe half an iron per storage unit. If its shelves, my vote would be one steel gets made into two shelving brackets, adding one bracket to a fence kit gives a shelving kit, and adding this to the two board pile would give a shelf capable of holding 4 items on each of its shelves.

*** Okay also to make sure they dont end up unremovable, before adding to the boards, you should have to add a rope to the shelving kit. Using an adze on the shelves yields boards and a shelving kit without rope.

Last edited by Anandamide (2019-03-24 21:21:09)

Glassius · 2019-03-24 21:44:49

Tarr wrote:

Make the convenience come from tech not more random piles.

I must disagree. New tech would probably be endgame. Endgame village do not need buff. Eve's camp do. Stacking meats will help Eves villages, endgame containers will not.

Booklat1 · 2019-03-24 21:50:31

idea: grow two wheat, can make a basket and 8 pies, taking 11 meat off the ground.

its better from a gameplay perspective to have mutton decay than stack.

BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-25 00:41:02

breezeknight wrote:

i see in many towns cars, planes, radios, kerosene pumps & their parts standing dry & useless while there is often not even fire, no kindling, the last axe is nearly broken, all carpentry tools are scattered, people chop down mango trees to get wood !!!

Just to be clear, I am chopping down mango trees in order to destroy the mango infestation, not because we need wood. See my newly updated signature below. The firewood is just a great by product that makes people slightly less likely to stab me for chopping down their precious clutter producers.

Regarding the meat stacking versus add a technology discussion - I am anti-clutter. Clearly Jason should do one or both of these things, with all haste. I don't have a firm opinion between the two.

I do have a different way to look at the problem: One of the problems that OHOL has right now, is that not enough of the casual players stick around. Would making meat stackable make people less disgusted with the cluttered towns? Would it make people more likely to get into the game and stay? Would having a "sack" technology using linen make people more likely to learn a technology and explore the joys of crafting presented by the game?

I think both of these would be of benefit. What if we make meats stackable, add a sack/linen technology, AND make meat outside of a container decay on a relatively short timer (something between 1-5 minutes).

The fact that stacking is not sufficient to preserve meat would be one of the many things that people learn when/if they stick around beyond the first couple hours of play, but we'd still have much cleaner towns at all tech levels.

BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-25 00:43:29

Also, I will stop chopping down mango trees at every opportunity the day that Jason makes plates of mango slices stackable. AKA never.

antking:]# · 2019-03-25 01:04:16

BlueDiamondAvatar wrote:

Also, I will stop chopping down mango trees at every opportunity the day that Jason makes plates of mango slices stackable. AKA never.

but you have to admit mangos make for great decretive trees!

breezeknight · 2019-03-25 02:13:14

BlueDiamondAvatar wrote:

breezeknight wrote:
i see in many towns cars, planes, radios, kerosene pumps & their parts standing dry & useless while there is often not even fire, no kindling, the last axe is nearly broken, all carpentry tools are scattered, people chop down mango trees to get wood !!!

Just to be clear, I am chopping down mango trees in order to destroy the mango infestation, not because we need wood. See my newly updated signature below. The firewood is just a great by product that makes people slightly less likely to stab me for chopping down their precious clutter producers.
Regarding the meat stacking versus add a technology discussion - I am anti-clutter. Clearly Jason should do one or both of these things, with all haste. I don't have a firm opinion between the two.
I do have a different way to look at the problem: One of the problems that OHOL has right now, is that not enough of the casual players stick around. Would making meat stackable make people less disgusted with the cluttered towns? Would it make people more likely to get into the game and stay? Would having a "sack" technology using linen make people more likely to learn a technology and explore the joys of crafting presented by the game?
I think both of these would be of benefit. What if we make meats stackable, add a sack/linen technology, AND make meat outside of a container decay on a relatively short timer (something between 1-5 minutes).
The fact that stacking is not sufficient to preserve meat would be one of the many things that people learn when/if they stick around beyond the first couple hours of play, but we'd still have much cleaner towns at all tech levels.

the town i've mentioned had a row of mango trees, the first time i've been there, about 10 maybe, so not really "infestation"
the mangos were in that life not really that needed but a good food alternative

the second time i've been there, all but two were chopped down, all wood from them gone, surroundings were bare any trees, one had to wander far to get some & people were starving, so those 10 mango trees would have been helpful

about the stackable meat matter

i am realistic
since Jason is just one guy, so it's absolutely impossible for him to do everything that would be needed asap
so i have to prioritize & rethink what would make the biggest impact on everyday handling of stuff in game, as gameplay

before the carrots stacking, it was carrot stacking & seed stacking
those cluttered the surface
together with those, was meat in the same boat (i mentioned that in the thread about carrot stacking), but carrots, since used for compost & wool & pies, were way more abundant than meat
that was not only before Jason finally made carrots stackable but also before he made the temperature update
that one update flipped the whole rabbits situation on its head
before that update rather mutton was cluttering the surface, but now, since fur clothing is being produced en mass, so rabbits are cluttering the surface
& it's not like mutton would be now less produced, only rabbit has surpassed mutton as clutter, that's the situation

here a screenshot from today, a smallish town in its beginnings & already rabbits compete for baskets with other areas
E9753C736632BBD9D02EFD351EB12B83517C0CCA

what we need NOW is a solution - a NOW solution & not an "If Jason would do this or that THEN" solution
& the NOW solution means - stackable meat
any other change, i have nothing against, but changes have to be made AFTER meat is out of the way, same as now carrots are out of the way

to pile up meat is rather simple to make for Jason,
doesn't need additional gameplay changes since there are already piles tested in game,
doesn't need new objects (containers/shelves),
doesn't need new gameplay (rotting meat)

it would be a simple change with a big everyday impact
nothing fancy, just unspectacular everyday management of a settlement

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BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-25 04:18:40

breezeknight wrote:

the town i've mentioned had a row of mango trees, the first time i've been there, about 10 maybe, so not really "infestation"
the mangos were in that life not really that needed but a good food alternative
the second time i've been there, all but two were chopped down, all wood from them gone, surroundings were bare any trees, one had to wander far to get some & people were starving, so those 10 mango trees would have been helpful

We are talking about Cletown, right? Cletown had ten mangoes and it was ABSOLUTELY an infestation. Ten mango trees can produce five mangos every time they are watered. Fifty + mangoes can be produced in twenty minutes or so. Times a few dozen cycles with no one bothering to put them on plates. There were literally hundreds of mangos stacked in baskets in the bakery at one point. Then someone decided to mass serve them. So we had fifty or so plates of mango slices littering the bakery and beyond.

Why do you think Cletown's farm looked so deserted? Why would anyone bother to make complex food when there's no space available and they can just slice more mangoes? Why were there no carrots or healthy bushes or wheat growing? Why was the massive water storage system drained to nothing? The mangoes.

Mangoes are a HUGE water and soil drain. Ferna's excellent thread on food sustainability shows they are worse than berry munching. WORSE THAN BERRIES!!!

This is what set me off. I chopped down five of the ten mango trees in Cletown. Sounds like I managed to convince some others to follow my example. Like I said originally, firewood access is only a nice by product.

More mangos were masking Cletown's central problems. Sounds like you were oblivious to how much the town is struggling when they had that pretty grove sitting there. Continuing to waste water and soil on them in the middle of the ongoing crises for food in that town would have been even worse than whatever conditions you faced the second time through.

breezeknight wrote:

what we need NOW is a solution - a NOW solution & not an "If Jason would do this or that THEN" solution
& the NOW solution means - stackable meat
any other change, i have nothing against, but changes have to be made AFTER meat is out of the way, same as now carrots are out of the way
to pile up meat is rather simple to make for Jason,
doesn't need additional gameplay changes since there are already piles tested in game,
doesn't need new objects (containers/shelves),
doesn't need new gameplay (rotting meat)

Ok, this I agree with.

Step 1) To happen ASAP, make all meats stackable.
Step 2) To happen as content deliverage allows, make some new storage technology and make meats decay

BTW, there's a post on the subreddit for OHOL suggestions that asks Jason to make at least one new thing stackable every week. He seems to have taken this to heart, so I think your wish for stackable meats is likely to come true shortly.

Sorry Tarr,

BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-25 04:40:33

antking:]# wrote:

BlueDiamondAvatar wrote:
Also, I will stop chopping down mango trees at every opportunity the day that Jason makes plates of mango slices stackable. AKA never.
but you have to admit mangos make for great decretive trees!

If potatoes were pretty, would it make you less ill to see piles of them littering the ground? Knowing that someone wasted a couple shovels on them?

Now imagine if the potato plants were still there regenerating even after someone wasted a shovel on them. That it was a low energy way for people to get more food, and so folks are very likely to dig up more potatoes in the next hour and the next and the next....

Mangoes are more evil than potatoes. Being pretty doesn't change that. They still represent a basket of soil and a *bucket* of water on a food that is worse than berry munching. NO THANK YOU!

(P.S. I killed three more mango trees today, and it was glorious.)

antking:]# · 2019-03-25 04:44:59

yes that's true but my point wasn't that mangoes are good (which they aren't) They just look nice that's all

and its a great thing that potatoes don't look nice as well!

Tarr · 2019-03-25 13:41:58

breezeknight wrote:

what we need NOW is a solution - a NOW solution & not an "If Jason would do this or that THEN" solution
& the NOW solution means - stackable meat
any other change, i have nothing against, but changes have to be made AFTER meat is out of the way, same as now carrots are out of the way
to pile up meat is rather simple to make for Jason,
doesn't need additional gameplay changes since there are already piles tested in game,
doesn't need new objects (containers/shelves),
doesn't need new gameplay (rotting meat)
it would be a simple change with a big everyday impact
nothing fancy, just unspectacular everyday management of a settlement
- - -

Here is a secret you may or may not know. You can cook meat by itself and remove it from cluttering up an area. If your priority is a clean space then you sacrifice the foods efficiency by eating it in a way that is lower total pips. If your priority is high food efficiency then you sacrifice space as the meat has to be stored in baskets/boxes/etc so you can save it for when you make pies.

The answer to your storage issue is right under your nose. Just cook the rabbits and eat them instead of hoarding them in a useless state.

Spoonwood · 2019-03-25 14:14:57

Tarr wrote:

Here is a secret you may or may not know. You can cook meat by itself and remove it from cluttering up an area. If your priority is a clean space then you sacrifice the foods efficiency by eating it in a way that is lower total pips. If your priority is high food efficiency then you sacrifice space as the meat has to be stored in baskets/boxes/etc so you can save it for when you make pies.
The answer to your storage issue is right under your nose. Just cook the rabbits and eat them instead of hoarding them in a useless state.

That's a waste of food and will just reset a player's yum chain.

breezeknight · 2019-03-25 14:18:14

Tarr wrote:

Here is a secret you may or may not know. You can cook meat by itself and remove it from cluttering up an area. If your priority is a clean space then you sacrifice the foods efficiency by eating it in a way that is lower total pips. If your priority is high food efficiency then you sacrifice space as the meat has to be stored in baskets/boxes/etc so you can save it for when you make pies.
The answer to your storage issue is right under your nose. Just cook the rabbits and eat them instead of hoarding them in a useless state.

here is a secret for you

cooked mutton & cooked rabbits are also not stackable

you only suggest to waste my in game time with doing something i don't want
it has absolutely nothing to do with any sort of a solution to the scattered meat problem
you are being ignorant & outright silly

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One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-03-24 07:57:54

Jason PLZ - next necessity

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Re: Jason PLZ - next necessity

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