An apology and a gloat

fragilityh14 · 2019-03-15 03:04:11

"Whatever" recently posted some stats to this forum, that while not including the whole community, get did include several prominent forum users who have posted lineages at various times.

My numbers are massive outliers, with my producing 1.5 as many grandchildren per female life as the next nearest [future bird] and twice that of the next one after that (Aurora)

I also have the highest percent of old age deaths, and thus the longest lifespan.

on top of that, i don't believe in /dying, so i at least live long enough to register in any life where it is feasible to do so.

There are a lot of variables one could control for, and that i'm more interested in base survival than high tech is a big one. Also that i don't like to abandon kids.

But, this explains a lot about some debates we've had in here. I didn't realize my play patterns were such an outlier. For one thing, i'm not generally especially good at multiplayer games. I'm an RPG and strategy game man [and then put it on highest speed and pause when i do things, or play turn based]. The only multiplayer game aspect i've ever been really good at is as a healer, or also i was randomly super good at the WC3 line tower wars mod [got accused of cheating all the time, and was just playing the game, and hadn't even played it that much]

Anyway, my apology here is that i legitimately didn't realize i was that much better at surviving than other people. i didn't realize I was playing so differently. I had no idea i was having way more kids.

i havn't really had a chance to figure out just what is going on, but i had been assuming I was average at surviving, and basing my conversations with other people on the premise they should be average like me.

Apparently I'm near the top for child producing and lifespan, which i never would have expected.

[well, I am far and away the top based on current existing data, I am sure there are other players who havn't been analyzed yet who have higher average lifespans and childbearing rates than i do.]

TL:DR If i've been living the longest and having the most grandkids, the way i've been interacting with players in game and in forums is unproductive in a variety of ways. I apologize, i'm going to try and think deeply and apply this knowledge in a useful way.

CrazyEddie · 2019-03-15 03:13:09

fragilityh14 wrote:

producing 1.5 as many grandchildren per female life as the next nearest
[..]
I also have the highest percent of old age deaths, and thus the longest lifespan.
[..]
on top of that, i don't believe in /dying

I do believe that #3 could have something to do with #2 and #1.

A meaningful comparison of survival and progeny-rearing skills would only include lives beyond, say, age three or so, so as to exclude lives where one deliberately kills oneself in infancy.

fragilityh14 · 2019-03-15 04:17:01

it only includes lives where you live past 3, so that i'm not /dying when i see a camp looks hopeless makes my lifespans all the more the outlier.

This is only lives where you live past 3.

futurebird · 2019-03-15 04:41:15

I'm amazed you haven't killed anyone. Even I had to do the murder once. (carrot seed greifer in a starving eve camp, not sorry)

Having living grad-kids is inversely correlated with killing I think. Could it be that just having more people matters that much? Even greifers have productive kids.

fragilityh14 · 2019-03-15 04:56:41

futurebird wrote:

I'm amazed you haven't killed anyone. Even I had to do the murder once. (carrot seed greifer in a starving eve camp, not sorry)
Having living grad-kids is inversely correlated with killing I think. Could it be that just having more people matters that much? Even griefers have productive kids.

Firstly, something that applies in this game, and all of human history, is THERE'S AN INFINITE AMOUNT OF VIOLENT GOONS. I could say that til i'm blue in the face, but it applies to every situation in history. There's always more people willing to kill than the world knows what to do with. i don't want to stab someone. Everytime a situation comes up where someone needs to get killed, someone pulls the knife before me. And they've chosen to do that before i've made a decision. When I have a problem, i don't go to my gun, I get away and try to figure out the situation.

A long time ago, when the screen just went black as soon as you died instead of 30 second death, I did stab someone, who asked me to, just out of curiosity, as a noob, I don't think it was tracked.

but, it was really just someone who wanted to quit and asked to be stabbed.

Also a long time ago, I don't know if this would have been tracked, I had a kid who asked me to kill him out of his boredom, and I refused to, and he later came back in my bakery and locked me in and said "You should have killed me" and then murdered me as I begged for my life, because I couldn't get out the damn door.

not that long ago, someone was massively in the way of me doing basic smithing, and everytime I said anything pulled a knife out, and I didn't have a knife

And i offered to teach, and still got the knife drawn again. But I didn't have one, if I did I totally would have stabbed the person. And I was a fertile woman, so i just kept running off. Then kind of checking back again. And another woman had stabbed him- I think it was just a noob where player was a bad human being- and I 100% would have stabbed that person given the opportunity, I just didn't have a knife and person was dead when i came back, but I stood up for the person who killed him.

But, there are important points here, i kind of just run away and avoid drama, though i've had some remarkable "only survivor of griefer" stories on that account.

edit:

Also, futurebird, it really seems like we broadly get along as people, I can be found on facebook with this username, if you're so inclined, though we may have radically different political views. [no desire to get into that here, just saying, were you to look me up on FB and friend request I'd accept]

Last edited by fragilityh14 (2019-03-15 05:03:08)

Grim_Arbiter · 2019-03-15 21:30:02

A new contender named grim steps in with:

grandkids per female life: 4.57

You beat me in average life age though by 0.29 haha.

Yeah I pretty much play like how you describe.. but I wouldn't apologize though. My only advice is maybe be interesting? Show your kids that stay the sights and joke with them. Sometimes I even give my kids middle names or a nickname if we don't have a last name.

Last edited by Grim_Arbiter (2019-03-15 21:47:05)

fragilityh14 · 2019-03-15 23:15:34

yeah I'm amazed at how you're doing so well! A few people are actually doing better than me, now that more have been added, but i clearly am still in the upper tier.

DestinyCall · 2019-03-15 23:24:52

Excellent parenting, Grim. I need to step up my game to match that.

kids: 1034
kids per female life: 3.46
avg. kid lifespan: 17.37
grandkids: 1016
grandkids per female life: 3.40

My new goal - see if I can push my grandkids stat higher than my kids stat. It's so close!

omlinson · 2019-03-16 00:57:27

fragilityh14 wrote:

I'm an RPG and strategy game man [and then put it on highest speed and pause when i do things, or play turn based].

the true question is. how long did it take you to move from turn based to being able to not have an anxiety attack at the thought of playing a grand strategy strategy game (not a RTS) with real time mechanics?

Last edited by omlinson (2019-03-16 01:01:10)

Spoonwood · 2019-03-16 01:33:01

I think you revealed that your "x yum" is usually higher than most other players, perhaps inadvertently, elsewhere. I would suspect that has something to do with your fertility numbers (though I don't believe it's the whole story).

You also teach your children to carry food, which does come as redundant for many players, but for anyone new that sure as heck can help.

DestinyCall · 2019-03-16 06:30:34

Pretty sure yum can't be the main reason, or I would assume your kid stats would be a lot higher, Spoon. But these numbers would be thrown off by a lot of soloing or spending more time on low-pop servers, so the math is far from perfect.

Still fun to theory-craft and compare notes. I'd like to see more people working to improve the survival rates of their kids. Gotta get that average kid lifespan over 14 or they aren't going to be alive long enough to give you grand kids!

BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-16 15:39:52

I'm in the latest batch of stats from Whatever. For 2019 only...

kids per female life: 5.53
grandkids per female life: 5.30

No further comment...

futurebird · 2019-03-16 15:49:00

How do you do that blue?

fragilityh14 · 2019-03-16 15:58:55

omlinson wrote:

fragilityh14 wrote:
I'm an RPG and strategy game man [and then put it on highest speed and pause when i do things, or play turn based].
the true question is. how long did it take you to move from turn based to being able to not have an anxiety attack at the thought of playing a grand strategy strategy game (not a RTS) with real time mechanics?

I player Crusader Kings on top speed and pause when I do things

And wow Blue Diamond!

Part of why i was so surprised when i was initially the highest one is that I also don't play in a way that would be conducive to getting the highest kids.

For one thing, i was gone for most of desert Eden, so I was around for early game, and then even in Desert Eden i wasn't staying in a lot of those camps, and kids would suicide because I wasn't on a desert, plus the lower fertility of it all.

i run off to start new camps a lot still, which causes fewer children to stay, and makes their lives somewhat harder.

i'm still glad to be on the higher end, even if some of you all are doing much better. It made absolutely no sense that my playstyle would have left me the champ of grandkids numbers. So this is all less confounding now

BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-16 17:26:29

I do a lot of the same things other people have talked about. I give my kids unique and interesting names, I spend my teens getting the nursery and/or town up to my standards. I order my kids to work on berries or something easy for their first few minutes of freedom. I adopt my grandkids, especially if one of my daughters wants to smith or catch rabbits or hunt bears.

I try to set something up for me to work on if I am on babysitting duty. Like, a stack of rabbits to make into clothes, or kindling to chop or something. I also like taking kids on tours - but keeping it quick and to the basics. Sometimes it helps to tell your kids what you did before they were born, so they get a sense of where the town is, and how you helped it.

If I don't stay in the nursery, I always name my kids first, and explain to them what work I'll be doing - if there's a bear that needs to be killed, or a farm that needs tending, or compost that needs to be made. And I make sure to say hi to them after they make it to the berry patch.

I also give my kids ideas for projects. I don't assign jobs... just make suggestions. I'll tell them what I think is the next missing step and why its important. And why I haven't been able to do it myself.

If I have a new player as a child, I'll teach them something interesting like tending sheep or making compost, rather than the rote berry tending.

I also shut down anyone talking up the "there are too many babies" myth. For one thing people die off naturally. For another, if more people are working more people can be fed. I tell complainers to shut up and start working. I stand up for my kids, chase after them if they are kidnapped, make sure they get clothing (when the adults are clothed). These things matter.

I also clean up the friggin' nursery. People underestimate the impact of being born into a bone pile. I'm convinced the cleanliness of your nursery impacts the likelihood of keeping a baby through toddlerhood.

But there's no one thing I do every time. I just have a bunch of strategies that I choose from based on the situation. I adapt based on the town and what everyone else is doing.

I think the biggest single idea is what Frag alluded to in the original post... Caring about other player's experiences. I'm here to have fun, and part of that is helping other people have fun, too.

Last edited by BlueDiamondAvatar (2019-03-16 18:33:52)

BlueDiamondAvatar · 2019-03-16 18:55:03

And Frag, you aren't off the hook as our child-raising champion yet... in the latest iteration of Whatever's *lifetime* player stats you have a kids/grandkids of 6.3/4.4, while I have a 4.6/4.5.

But Grim and Aurora are both higher, too. And Whatever is still finding ways to improve his formula. Sooo... anything could happen!

Now we know we can measure these stats, it'll be interesting to see how things play out in the coming months. I'd sure be interested in monthly updates. I love that there is finally a way to compare how good we are at babyraising.

InSpace · 2019-03-16 19:06:55

The two and only important things that matters in this game is how well organized you are and how well you are at gathering materials

DestinyCall · 2019-03-16 20:06:09

BlueDiamondAvatar wrote:

I also shut down anyone talking up the "there are too many babies" myth. For one thing people die off naturally. For another, if more people are working more people can be fed. I tell complainers to shut up and start working. I stand up for my kids, chase after them if they are kidnapped, make sure they get clothing (when the adults are clothed). These things matter.

Yeah, I'm right there with you. Same with the "kill all boys. They are useless/more mouths to feed."

I'm a strong supporter of raising every baby to toddlerhood, regardless of whatever might be going on with the rest of the village. If the kid is willing to stick around and help the struggling village, I'm going to give him/her the opportunity as long as I can manage to keep myself alive while doing it. Sometimes, this means heading out to raise kids in a banana grove or roving from berry bush to berry bush until they are old enough to feed themselves. Other times, it means putting the kid on the fire and running around like a crazy person to fix broken supply chains while occassionally stopping back in to feed the babies when they say F.

I don't think there's any real benefit to intentionally letting a baby starve during a food crisis, if you are not dying yourself. If you can stay fed, the baby only costs a few pips to keep going. And if you continue to breastfeed as long as possible, the toddler costs very little food too. Lots of people die when food runs out, so you will need more workers to replace the dead ones after the food supply recovers. The famine kills off inexperienced players much faster than experienced ones, so a baby that survives an early food crisis is usually a solid contributer as an adult. And keeping more boys means more adult workers in the next generation while keeping population growth lower, so you have more time to build up better food reserves. It is a win-win.

Spoonwood · 2019-03-16 22:06:01

DestinyCall wrote:

Pretty sure yum can't be the main reason, or I would assume your kid stats would be a lot higher, Spoon. But these numbers would be thrown off by a lot of soloing or spending more time on low-pop servers, so the math is far from perfect.

So, I started almost entirely doing low-population runs after the big server update. Before that I did Eve runs mostly for a few weeks as I recall. Before that I did have some lives where I yummed, but before that I played a bunch more where I didn't quite understand yum or didn't do it much. Also, I started playing before yum affected fertility. So, I don't think that my grandchildren numbers can get used to infer much about yum, with all of that in mind.

fragilityh14 · 2019-03-17 06:50:37

BlueDiamondAvatar wrote:

And Frag, you aren't off the hook as our child-raising champion yet... in the latest iteration of Whatever's *lifetime* player stats you have a kids/grandkids of 6.3/4.4, while I have a 4.6/4.5.
But Grim and Aurora are both higher, too. And Whatever is still finding ways to improve his formula. Sooo... anything could happen!
Now we know we can measure these stats, it'll be interesting to see how things play out in the coming months. I'd sure be interested in monthly updates. I love that there is finally a way to compare how good we are at babyraising.

I was feeling guilty about my hubris as the compared player base increased, though my pride was mostly fromm shock, as I had thought i was doing quite poorly as far as things go, then suddenly had a glorious number compared to the other people shown.

also though honestly I wasn't playing for much of the "Desert Eden" and was slow to adopt desert camps when i came back, and often ran off to start my own camps that were on desert, and then there was the big temp update...so i wasn't really playing at ideal times or styles for the most children in some ways, but none of us were playing for stats, so i'm sure everyone has a variable that would theoretically pump their numbers.

Edit: Aurora's went from 1.7 to 5.5 because of methods being changed. So, I don't know what to take from any of these numbers. I mean, that is really, really extreme. Though, it being Aurora, fk knows what she's doing that isn't like how the rest of us play.

Last edited by fragilityh14 (2019-03-17 06:54:37)

DestinyCall · 2019-03-17 07:24:22

fragilityh14 wrote:

Edit: Aurora's went from 1.7 to 5.5 because of methods being changed. So, I don't know what to take from any of these numbers. I mean, that is really, really extreme. Though, it being Aurora, fk knows what she's doing that isn't like how the rest of us play.

Mark Twain once said "There are lies, damn lies, and statistics." He's not wrong.

Stats are fascinating, but they can change quite a bit depending on how you tally the results and what variables you try to control for or don't control at all. It's probably always a good idea to take these kind of numbers with a grain of salt.

omlinson · 2019-03-17 19:51:34

fragilityh14 wrote:

Crusader Kings

that's the game that finally made me realize that a non turn based game can feel really really really slow even at the fastest speed.

Whatever · 2019-03-17 20:09:58

fragilityh14 wrote:

Edit: Aurora's went from 1.7 to 5.5 because of methods being changed. So, I don't know what to take from any of these numbers. I mean, that is really, really extreme. Though, it being Aurora, fk knows what she's doing that isn't like how the rest of us play.

There were some bugs, i am sorry for that, i fixed them, i think the stats are fine now. My plan is to leave them like they are now.
EDIT: Ok maybe i will do one more update tomorrow.

Last edited by Whatever (2019-03-17 20:19:57)

Spoonwood · 2019-03-17 20:44:40

DestinyCall wrote:

fragilityh14 wrote:
Edit: Aurora's went from 1.7 to 5.5 because of methods being changed. So, I don't know what to take from any of these numbers. I mean, that is really, really extreme. Though, it being Aurora, fk knows what she's doing that isn't like how the rest of us play.
Mark Twain once said "There are lies, damn lies, and statistics." He's not wrong.
Stats are fascinating, but they can change quite a bit depending on how you tally the results and what variables you try to control for or don't control at all. It's probably always a good idea to take these kind of numbers with a grain of salt.

You need to take that bowl and go out and find an ice hole, then you need to make hot coals dry the saltwater out. Until you do that, your talk of taking things with salt, even a grain of salt, is rather idle. *laughing*

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-03-15 03:04:11

An apology and a gloat

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