Idea: Harsher Life System.

JasonY · 2020-01-04 04:36:17

I don't think anybody ever runs out of lives anymore, Curses also seem pretty shit. I've been cursed by an entire town for a well-deserved kill and simply respawned in a nearby village and ran back to loot my body.

So here's an idea, Life regen rate be based on genetic score. Curses will reduce your score, Getting a lot will tank your score. Lower life cap, Harder to regain lives.

Another idea people won't like. Curses cost lives but you can curse the same person. With good gene score, you can build up lives faster and use them to either respawn or stop griefers from playing. But if someone does it to you, Others can curse and kill them. They waste their lives and end up with a low score themselves.

Punkypal · 2020-01-04 05:34:26

As I said in another current thread, anything regarding the cursing system that gives the individual more power to curse is apt for misuse and abuse. The solution to fix the system is to make the power of the community stronger, not the individual. 10 people all cursing 1 same player should have a multiplying effect. 1 curse should have the power of only 1, but each curse beyond that grows more powerful. By the time you have 10 curses, each one against you is over 50x stronger. The only way an individual's curse should get more powerful is if others also curse the same person you have cursed. That's how it should be.

Not running out of lives in itself isn't a problem to be solved. Griefers having less lives isn't really a fix for anything. I imagine a griefer doesn't have much need to use /DIE or suicide anyway. Very few go on murder sprees at young age, and even when they do and maybe are killed around age 20, they would still be regaining lives fast enough to not reach zero. I assume they aren't playing 24 hours a day that is.

Your final paragraph sounds like what you want is for the curse system to be turned into a griefers tool. No thanks.

Last edited by Punkypal (2020-01-04 08:04:23)

JasonY · 2020-01-04 08:09:03

Punkypal wrote:

As I said in another current thread, anything regarding the cursing system that gives the individual more power to curse is apt for misuse and abuse. The solution to fix the system is to make the power of the community stronger, not the individual. 10 people all cursing 1 same player should have a multiplying effect. 1 curse should have the power of only 1, but each curse beyond that grows more powerful. By the time you have 10 curses, each one against you is over 50x stronger. The only way an individual's curse should get more powerful is if others also curse the same person you have cursed. That's how it should be.
Not running out of lives in itself isn't a problem to be solved. Griefers having less lives isn't really a fix for anything. I imagine a griefer doesn't have much need to use /DIE or suicide anyway. Very few go on murder sprees at young age, and even when they do and maybe are killed around age 20, they would still be regaining lives fast enough to not reach zero. I assume they aren't playing 24 hours a day that is.
Your final paragraph sounds like what you want is for the curse system to be turned into a griefers tool. No thanks.

As predicted.

Last edited by JasonY (2020-01-04 08:09:23)

jcwilk · 2020-01-04 23:06:10

Punkypal wrote:

As I said in another current thread, anything regarding the cursing system that gives the individual more power to curse is apt for misuse and abuse. The solution to fix the system is to make the power of the community stronger, not the individual. 10 people all cursing 1 same player should have a multiplying effect. 1 curse should have the power of only 1, but each curse beyond that grows more powerful. By the time you have 10 curses, each one against you is over 50x stronger. The only way an individual's curse should get more powerful is if others also curse the same person you have cursed. That's how it should be.
Not running out of lives in itself isn't a problem to be solved. Griefers having less lives isn't really a fix for anything. I imagine a griefer doesn't have much need to use /DIE or suicide anyway. Very few go on murder sprees at young age, and even when they do and maybe are killed around age 20, they would still be regaining lives fast enough to not reach zero. I assume they aren't playing 24 hours a day that is.
Your final paragraph sounds like what you want is for the curse system to be turned into a griefers tool. No thanks.

And as I said in that other thread, I don't think you understand what cursing does. Number of curses is irrelevant and there's no "power" of curses to scale. Cursing is basically like a block feature, imagine someone saying "if five people block you in discord then it should be as if 10 people blocked you" it doesn't make any sense.

Punkypal · 2020-01-04 23:44:09

jcwilk wrote:

Punkypal wrote:
As I said in another current thread, anything regarding the cursing system that gives the individual more power to curse is apt for misuse and abuse. The solution to fix the system is to make the power of the community stronger, not the individual. 10 people all cursing 1 same player should have a multiplying effect. 1 curse should have the power of only 1, but each curse beyond that grows more powerful. By the time you have 10 curses, each one against you is over 50x stronger. The only way an individual's curse should get more powerful is if others also curse the same person you have cursed. That's how it should be.
Not running out of lives in itself isn't a problem to be solved. Griefers having less lives isn't really a fix for anything. I imagine a griefer doesn't have much need to use /DIE or suicide anyway. Very few go on murder sprees at young age, and even when they do and maybe are killed around age 20, they would still be regaining lives fast enough to not reach zero. I assume they aren't playing 24 hours a day that is.
Your final paragraph sounds like what you want is for the curse system to be turned into a griefers tool. No thanks.
And as I said in that other thread, I don't think you understand what cursing does. Number of curses is irrelevant and there's no "power" of curses to scale. Cursing is basically like a block feature, imagine someone saying "if five people block you in discord then it should be as if 10 people blocked you" it doesn't make any sense.

I do know what cursing does, and what it does is basically nothing. I know it's a brain buster but I'm suggesting CHANGING how curses work so it does something. Let me try again and I'll explain this time in great detail and teaching basic math also and I'll hope you have the ability to comprehend. I'm going to walk you thru it in a basic terms as I can.

Lets's say you get one curse. Your account would note you have ONE curse from ONE player. That curse would have the effect of one curse with the ban radius of one curse. (as it is currently).

Now lets say you get a SECOND curse from another player. Now your account would record that you have TWO curses. The game would do this math to see the effect on you: 1 (for the first curse) x 1.5 (the multiplier applied by the second curse) = 1.5 total. The 1.5 total would round down (always round do to nearest whole number), so now each player's curse against you still has a normal radius as is currently, but there are TWO players you can't be born near (still the same).

Now lets say you get a THIRD curse from a third player. Here is where curses against you would start to amplify. The math is 1 (for the first curse) x 1.5 (multiplier for the second curse) x 1.5 (multiplier for the third curse) = 2.25 total. 2.25 would round down to 2. What this would mean is that THREE players would exist that you can't be born near, but now the radius away from them is DOUBLE, for EACH PLAYER who had cursed you.

Let's go in to a FOURTH curse. The math is 1 x 1.5 x 1.5 x 1.5 = 3.375. 3.337 That rounds down to 3. So now there would be FOUR players you can't be born near, except the radius is THREE TIMES as large for EACH PLAYER as having only one curse would be from one player.

Do you get it now? I am aware this isn't how it currently works. Jason would have to CHANGE it so it works this way. If he did make it work this way it would be possible for a person who have MANY curses against them to actually be sent to Donkeytown, or at least be FAR away from who cursed them. Currently there is virtually no way to be sent to Donkeytown (I mean there is, you'd have to have curses from well over half the player base for it to happen. Considering some players never use curse, it pretty much can't happen). Also as it is now someone you cursed can be born so close that they can run over to where you are in about 60 seconds. With this system, someone with 6 or 7 curses still probably won't go to Donkeytown due to how spread out players tend to get, but they at least would be so far away that they are much less likely to be back near who cursed them. At 7 curses we are talking 2,200 tiles away. Yea, they can still get back, but it will take them a third of their life. That's 20 years that they can't be destructive. And if they run all the way back and get cursed again, next time they are 3,400 tiles away. It wouldn't take long for cereal griefers to be gone from your play area entirely. At least until your curse against them expires.

One player curseing the same person more than once would NOT increase their multiplier. It would only refresh the expiration time for that players curse against them. The multiplier is only for each active curse from each additional player. If you log on and there happens to be NOBODY online who had cursed you, it would be as if you had no curses (just as it is now) and you could be born anywhere. But of course, the more players that have cursed you, the less likely that this is to be the case.

And for the record curses are nothing like a block feature on Discord, Unless Discord has some way that someone you blocked can exert less than 60 seconds of effort to undo your block. OHOL all a player has to do to get "unblocked" is run back to wherever you are. That can be very quick and easy.

Last edited by Punkypal (2020-01-04 23:57:50)

jcwilk · 2020-01-05 03:53:21

Punkypal wrote:

jcwilk wrote:
Punkypal wrote:
As I said in another current thread, anything regarding the cursing system that gives the individual more power to curse is apt for misuse and abuse. The solution to fix the system is to make the power of the community stronger, not the individual. 10 people all cursing 1 same player should have a multiplying effect. 1 curse should have the power of only 1, but each curse beyond that grows more powerful. By the time you have 10 curses, each one against you is over 50x stronger. The only way an individual's curse should get more powerful is if others also curse the same person you have cursed. That's how it should be.
Not running out of lives in itself isn't a problem to be solved. Griefers having less lives isn't really a fix for anything. I imagine a griefer doesn't have much need to use /DIE or suicide anyway. Very few go on murder sprees at young age, and even when they do and maybe are killed around age 20, they would still be regaining lives fast enough to not reach zero. I assume they aren't playing 24 hours a day that is.
Your final paragraph sounds like what you want is for the curse system to be turned into a griefers tool. No thanks.
And as I said in that other thread, I don't think you understand what cursing does. Number of curses is irrelevant and there's no "power" of curses to scale. Cursing is basically like a block feature, imagine someone saying "if five people block you in discord then it should be as if 10 people blocked you" it doesn't make any sense.
I do know what cursing does, and what it does is basically nothing. I know it's a brain buster but I'm suggesting CHANGING how curses work so it does something. Let me try again and I'll explain this time in great detail and teaching basic math also and I'll hope you have the ability to comprehend. I'm going to walk you thru it in a basic terms as I can.
Lets's say you get one curse. Your account would note you have ONE curse from ONE player. That curse would have the effect of one curse with the ban radius of one curse. (as it is currently).
Now lets say you get a SECOND curse from another player. Now your account would record that you have TWO curses. The game would do this math to see the effect on you: 1 (for the first curse) x 1.5 (the multiplier applied by the second curse) = 1.5 total. The 1.5 total would round down (always round do to nearest whole number), so now each player's curse against you still has a normal radius as is currently, but there are TWO players you can't be born near (still the same).
Now lets say you get a THIRD curse from a third player. Here is where curses against you would start to amplify. The math is 1 (for the first curse) x 1.5 (multiplier for the second curse) x 1.5 (multiplier for the third curse) = 2.25 total. 2.25 would round down to 2. What this would mean is that THREE players would exist that you can't be born near, but now the radius away from them is DOUBLE, for EACH PLAYER who had cursed you.
Let's go in to a FOURTH curse. The math is 1 x 1.5 x 1.5 x 1.5 = 3.375. 3.337 That rounds down to 3. So now there would be FOUR players you can't be born near, except the radius is THREE TIMES as large for EACH PLAYER as having only one curse would be from one player.
Do you get it now? I am aware this isn't how it currently works. Jason would have to CHANGE it so it works this way. If he did make it work this way it would be possible for a person who have MANY curses against them to actually be sent to Donkeytown, or at least be FAR away from who cursed them. Currently there is virtually no way to be sent to Donkeytown (I mean there is, you'd have to have curses from well over half the player base for it to happen. Considering some players never use curse, it pretty much can't happen). Also as it is now someone you cursed can be born so close that they can run over to where you are in about 60 seconds. With this system, someone with 6 or 7 curses still probably won't go to Donkeytown due to how spread out players tend to get, but they at least would be so far away that they are much less likely to be back near who cursed them. At 7 curses we are talking 2,200 tiles away. Yea, they can still get back, but it will take them a third of their life. That's 20 years that they can't be destructive. And if they run all the way back and get cursed again, next time they are 3,400 tiles away. It wouldn't take long for cereal griefers to be gone from your play area entirely. At least until your curse against them expires.
One player curseing the same person more than once would NOT increase their multiplier. It would only refresh the expiration time for that players curse against them. The multiplier is only for each active curse from each additional player. If you log on and there happens to be NOBODY online who had cursed you, it would be as if you had no curses (just as it is now) and you could be born anywhere. But of course, the more players that have cursed you, the less likely that this is to be the case.
And for the record curses are nothing like a block feature on Discord, Unless Discord has some way that someone you blocked can exert less than 60 seconds of effort to undo your block. OHOL all a player has to do to get "unblocked" is run back to wherever you are. That can be very quick and easy.

TL;DR - but i skimmed it to see that you backpedaled your suggestion to be talking about curse radius rather than number of curses, something previously unmentioned. Your previous suggestion makes zero sense, your suggestion about curse radius makes some sense although there's still the odd wrinkle of whether it's curses from players online or curses from players offline also.

Changing it to take into effect offline players is a pretty big change because it changes the feature from being a neutral blocking system to a punishment system, which Jason explicit said it was not in one of the posts about it.

Making it be only online players is also odd because suddenly when Jimmy comes online, Bob's radius gets larger. Why does the cursee get more deeply penalized in a part of the map that has nothing to do with Jimmy just because Jimmy came online? And imagine trying to determine whether the system is functioning correctly or not, people with barely any curses on them could suddenly be shot to DT just cause the 6 people (perhaps griefers) that cursed him are all online at the same time.

For a game where player driven chaos is a desired element but where someone should be able to minimize the amount of time they spend playing with someone they don't like, the existing system is fine but the timing might need help. Two hours of gameplay is kinda long for a new token, hence why i like jasony's general direction.

Punkypal · 2020-01-05 05:40:05

I did admit on my second posting on the subject that I was perhaps not very clear. I will concede that maybe you missed that post. There has been a fair amount of activity on the forums lately it seems and it can be hard to keep up with all the things everyone is tossing out.

I have also noticed that some folks seem to think the problem with the curse system isn't that it does little to discourage major griefers, but that they can't pass out enough curses for every other player that bothers them in the slightest. They are fine that a curse is a minor annoyance at most. They just want to pass out those minor annoyances to more players. My suggestion does noting to fix that "problem", not that I think it is a problem, but....to each his own.

Coming back to my suggestion though. I am proposing that the number of curses one has stacked against them would determine the radius, regardless if a player was online or not. If only one player from that list was online and the cursed player had MANY curses against them active, then yes, they would face a large ban radius from that player who had cursed them. None of the other players would have to be online to affect the curse radius. If two were online, then both would have that same large radius from wherever they were. The only way the curse radius goes down is when a curse expires.

However: If Jason wanted to get more complex each curse after the "first" could have a diminishing effect. Simple example: Second curse for first 24 hours has multiplier of 1.5x, next 24 hours it becomes 1.4x, then after another 24 hours 1.3x and so on until after 5 days it would be 1.0x and not factor to increase the radius. Each additional curse you have could have different multipliers, but the point is they all diminish slowly as they get closer to expiring. I admit I'm not sure currently how long a curse lasts. I've read 7 days and also 30 days. For my suggestion I've be going on an assumption of 7 days

I suppose I am calling for curses to be more of a "punishment", but I'm not the only one asking for this. I at least feel like the punishment should fit the crime. If you occasionally get a little rowdy or make a mistake, a simple slap on the wrist should be all you incur. If you imagine yourself a master of chaos and the ONLY thing you ever do is try to destroy then you should face a greater consequence for your efforts and actions (if you're caught). Jason can tweak all sorts of base factors to tailor this system to his liking. The multiplier can star out lower, or higher. The number of curses you get before additional ones start to become multipliers can be higher (i.e. it isn't until the 4th curse that a 1.5x multiplier or whatever factor is applied). He could make the radius start smaller than it currently is, or he could put a cap on the max radius (so radius would still grow, but not forever).

There are lot's of options Jason could use to tweak this. My problem with the current curse system isn't just that it's 99% useless, but also that it's too individual oriented. In a game about community and society, I think the weight of the community should factor in to in. Let me give an example. I think most players who read the forums know I'm a road builder. If someone wanted they could easily track me down (when and if I'm back in the game) and target me specifically. I could curse them over and over and it wouldn't have any extra harm against them. But if they chase me into a town and kill me in front of everyone and get 4 curses that should carry a stiffer penalty because now they have become notorious.

I fully believe that the griefer who can work in the shadows and be an agent of chaos in the background without getting exposed should face no penalty (just as in real life). Right now griefers can pose a challenge and hinder the community player's efforts, but the community can't do much in return. Where is the real challenge for the griefer? Where is their penalty for failure?

Last edited by Punkypal (2020-01-05 05:51:08)

QuirkySmirkyIan · 2020-01-05 15:20:05

Punky arguing about curses again...

Punkypal · 2020-01-05 20:44:07

QuirkySmirkyIan wrote:

Punky arguing about curses again...

Actually explaining to someone who didn't understand because they skim posts instead of reading them. Sound like anyone you know?

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2020-01-04 04:36:17

Idea: Harsher Life System.

#2 2020-01-04 05:34:26

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#3 2020-01-04 08:09:03

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#4 2020-01-04 23:06:10

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#5 2020-01-04 23:44:09

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#6 2020-01-05 03:53:21

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#7 2020-01-05 05:40:05

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#8 2020-01-05 15:20:05

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

#9 2020-01-05 20:44:07

Re: Idea: Harsher Life System.

Board footer