Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

Punkypal · 2019-12-12 21:46:12

So I just got to witness a town wiped out and the Winter clan destroyed by one greifer killer. What follows is why the game often sucks.

1) The system to kill someone is awkward and clunky. It makes no sense. Sometimes you shoot, sometimes you don't. You always run around toward your target instead of just standing still. Killers use biomes to their advantage in this way. When you try to kill a murder greifer they hide in a biome you can't enter and you drop your weapon trying to even target them, Why? Because STUPID is why.

2) People who make killing all they do know how to better use this stupid awkward system. Average players don't. This gives killers an extreme advantage.

3) It takes tool slots to even use a weapon, which might make other players helpless. More advantage to the killers.

4) With all the confusion, language barriers, not being able to say many letters if you are young, all this plays to the killers advantage.

5) With a boundless world, is cursing even doing anything? People never curse someone unless they see them commit a crime, no matter what is reported. Most people who see the crime either can't curse at the time because they used theirs recently, don't know how, are too young, or just don't bother. A guy can wipe a town and maybe pick up two curses. Big deal! You're more likely to get cursed for picking up someone's rag hat they left in the middle of nowhere without asking.

For the record. I killed this guy. He was named Tim Winter. But the system is such a joke I couldn't do anything before he had already done his damage. Having to search the sea of junk for weapons, eventually having to go to another town to get bow and arrow. Took so long that in the end he's won. They always win, that's why they keep doing this. I imagine all these murder griefers are pre-pubescent fatties who suck hard at Fortnite. They don't play any game where others have a real chance to fight back because they have zero skills. Hey, if you want these losers to ruin your game that's your call Jason. People don't much enjoy being fish in a barrel.

jcwilk · 2019-12-12 22:18:14

Punkypal wrote:

So I just got to witness a town wiped out and the Winter clan destroyed by one greifer killer. What follows is why the game often sucks.
1) The system to kill someone is awkward and clunky. It makes no sense. Sometimes you shoot, sometimes you don't. You always run around toward your target instead of just standing still. Killers use biomes to their advantage in this way. When you try to kill a murder greifer they hide in a biome you can't enter and you drop your weapon trying to even target them, Why? Because STUPID is why.
2) People who make killing all they do know how to better use this stupid awkward system. Average players don't. This gives killers an extreme advantage.
3) It takes tool slots to even use a weapon, which might make other players helpless. More advantage to the killers.
4) With all the confusion, language barriers, not being able to say many letters if you are young, all this plays to the killers advantage.
5) With a boundless world, is cursing even doing anything? People never curse someone unless they see them commit a crime, no matter what is reported. Most people who see the crime either can't curse at the time because they used theirs recently, don't know how, are too young, or just don't bother. A guy can wipe a town and maybe pick up two curses. Big deal! You're more likely to get cursed for picking up someone's rag hat they left in the middle of nowhere without asking.
For the record. I killed this guy. He was named Tim Winter. But the system is such a joke I couldn't do anything before he had already done his damage. Having to search the sea of junk for weapons, eventually having to go to another town to get bow and arrow. Took so long that in the end he's won. They always win, that's why they keep doing this. I imagine all these murder griefers are pre-pubescent fatties who suck hard at Fortnite. They don't play any game where others have a real chance to fight back because they have zero skills. Hey, if you want these losers to ruin your game that's your call Jason. People don't much enjoy being fish in a barrel.

2 - practice makes perfect

4 - living with families besides your own being complicated and precarious is the point

5 - yeah cursing needs a buff, it's way too soft at the moment and is not at all an effective incentive to behave unless you really, really want to spawn in the biggest city and can't stand running 5 or 10 minutes to get there when you spawn nearby instead

Spoonwood · 2019-12-12 22:56:16

Punkypal wrote:

With a boundless world, is cursing even doing anything? People never curse someone unless they see them commit a crime, no matter what is reported. Most people who see the crime either can't curse at the time because they used theirs recently, don't know how, are too young, or just don't bother. A guy can wipe a town and maybe pick up two curses.

The people who cursed that guy won't birth near him in future lives for a while as I've heard. So, it may do something for the player who speaks the curse. Of course, that's not to say that the curse is likely to come as part of a process that effectively penalizes the griefer.

MCzerotacos · 2019-12-13 14:46:00

Punkypal wrote:

So I just got to witness a town wiped out and the Winter clan destroyed by one greifer killer. What follows is why the game often sucks.
1) The system to kill someone is awkward and clunky. It makes no sense. Sometimes you shoot, sometimes you don't. You always run around toward your target instead of just standing still. Killers use biomes to their advantage in this way. When you try to kill a murder greifer they hide in a biome you can't enter and you drop your weapon trying to even target them, Why? Because STUPID is why.
2) People who make killing all they do know how to better use this stupid awkward system. Average players don't. This gives killers an extreme advantage.
3) It takes tool slots to even use a weapon, which might make other players helpless. More advantage to the killers.
4) With all the confusion, language barriers, not being able to say many letters if you are young, all this plays to the killers advantage.
5) With a boundless world, is cursing even doing anything? People never curse someone unless they see them commit a crime, no matter what is reported. Most people who see the crime either can't curse at the time because they used theirs recently, don't know how, are too young, or just don't bother. A guy can wipe a town and maybe pick up two curses. Big deal! You're more likely to get cursed for picking up someone's rag hat they left in the middle of nowhere without asking.
For the record. I killed this guy. He was named Tim Winter. But the system is such a joke I couldn't do anything before he had already done his damage. Having to search the sea of junk for weapons, eventually having to go to another town to get bow and arrow. Took so long that in the end he's won. They always win, that's why they keep doing this. I imagine all these murder griefers are pre-pubescent fatties who suck hard at Fortnite. They don't play any game where others have a real chance to fight back because they have zero skills. Hey, if you want these losers to ruin your game that's your call Jason. People don't much enjoy being fish in a barrel.

A reason to all your misfortunes can be explained right here.

1) How many times have people banded together to kill a greifer in OHOL? From my experience in the game, we have all managed to kill every single one and been able to survive. Family clans who don't survive those type of antics simply just shouldn't survive anyways. In the past of many great human civilaztions, greifer/murderers are always in some way shape or form dedicated to what they do. How do we deal with this? Same way as all great human civilaztions have done, chase them out. Making pads, knives, bone needle, and thread isn't hard at all. So, greifers can be a problem yes, but if your clan village doesn't have a fail safe, that is on them. You should remember you are playing a game and with games come along greifers. It's to be expected that if you know that there can be greifers, you must always have a back up plan.

2) Honestly, if a greifer tries to kill people they only have one maybe two chances. You should know if someone is trying to kill someone because of the sound affects made from trying to kill a player or the exclamation marks that show up at the edges of your screen. Many players hate greifers with a passion, so it is not hard to gather a group and find the greifer to then kill him/her. One or two players might die in the conflict but it is to be expected. Now if an entire village dies well... That is simply just the villages fault for not being smart. A village should ALWAYS have a medic or two.

3) Your right that tool slots can be cumbersome, but I believe Jason's goal is to in some way shape or form replicate and/or simulate human evolution in past civilaztions from human history. If you look back at human history you can see that people are specialist not generalist when it comes to jobs. Although it gives greifers an advantage, it makes the game more challenging as well. Also if we just take the tool slots off and return to the olden days where we have NO tool slots, wouldn't you think that there might be more greifers than what we currently have? Tool slots can be cumbersome, but reality is also a key feature to this game.

4) You are YOUNG! What are you supposed to say when you are young? Oh help me I need to drink from your breasts? No! Babies are babies, they can't say full sentences and oh maybe just maybe, I don't know if you ever thought of this but, can humans babies form complex sentences? If they can send me a video of an infant being born that can actually form complex sentences. However, the language system can be awful but that's what humans have had to deal with when they met new people from different clans. It's to be expected that you can't just understand what another person is saying if they are ethnically different.

5) I do agree with you on one small matter and it is cursing. The way people use cursing and the way it affects people is not nearly as strong as it should be. Cursing someone can be useful but only if everyone uses. I have played several games where there are greifers and we manage to kill them, but when it comes to cursing them, some people are just too damn focused on there jobs that they don't care to even curse the greifer. Cursing can also be used for greifing, there was a scenario in which I was in a village raised as a sheep farm. Everything was fine until I saw someone stab a girl. So what did I do, of course I stabbed her back so that she would die because I thought she was greifing. Well, she wasn't greifing, she was teaching someone how to heal someone who has been stabbed. now I didn't know that and so, when I stabbed her everyone started cursing me. Now, this isn't really a greifing scenario, but the point is still the same. Cursing someone is not enough and but, I don't know if there is even anything else we could say or do to deal with greifers. Just like how muderers are bound to show up the same is with greifers.

In the end I truly believe that the changes Jason has done are extremely helpful and creates challenge for people based on reality and our history as a species. There can be minor tweaks to the system but, I am not sure what we can do to combat greifing since it is inevitable. If you guys have any suggestions, whatever it is, it would be helpful to say it since it would give Jason a better understanding on how he could deal with this issue.

Punkypal · 2019-12-13 15:20:40

cordy wrote:

So that means Tim Winter had been terrorizing two towns.

Yes, I put an end to him just north of the second town when he tried to flee after killing someone there.

Spoonwood · 2019-12-13 16:12:24

MCzerotacos wrote:

Making pads, knives, bone needle, and thread isn't hard at all. So, greifers can be a problem yes, but if your clan village doesn't have a fail safe, that is on them.

Have you ever played as a true Eve starting from scratch?

MCzerotacos wrote:

Now if an entire village dies well... That is simply just the villages fault for not being smart.

Villages can be rather small sometimes. I don't think it appropriate that you rush to judgment like you did.

MCzerotacos wrote:

Your right that tool slots can be cumbersome, but I believe Jason's goal is to in some way shape or form replicate and/or simulate human evolution in past civilaztions from human history.

No. The game is not a historical simulator. It takes place in the future in the realm of thought experiments:

jasonrohrer wrote:

The game takes place in the realm of thought experiments.
It is "in the future," because the thought experiment is about the future.
But this world is obviously not earth.... it is 50,000x bigger than earth, and it has no oceans. So there was no apocalypse here. There are no ruins.
The world is the imaginary space inside which this thought experiment plays out:
"If we had to start over from scratch, but kept all of our knowledge, how long would it take us to get back to iPhones?" where iPhones are a placeholder for whatever sufficiently advanced tech we can imagine.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8576

MCzerotacos wrote:

If you look back at human history you can see that people are specialist not generalist when it comes to jobs.

Tool slots are not jobs. The tool slot system is not a job system. If it were, then using a skewer to till soil would have to consist in the use of a tool, but it doesn't. Also, cooking and smithing are jobs. But, throwing kindling on hot coals takes up a tool slot, and thus doesn't fit with only one job. Using a knife takes up a tool slot. But what's the associated job? Is it sheparding, cooking, or smithing (charcoal pencils need a knife to make and you need a charcoal pencil to make a scrap bowl to recycle steel), or town police/protection? A shovel is a tool. But again, if it were a job system, what's the job? Composting needs the use of a shovel, but so does making fences, so does turning big hard rocks into stone blocks, and so does digging up tule stumps for adobe.

There is also no limitation on how many tools a person can learn to use in the real world. It's not realistic that people can't learn more things, because of the number of people in the world that exist (I note that tool slots only exist when a server has 15 or more players on it). Jason describes his objectives for tool slots here: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8181

MCzerotacos wrote:

Also if we just take the tool slots off and return to the olden days where we have NO tool slots, wouldn't you think that there might be more greifers than what we currently have?

I didn't get asked, but no, I don't. I don't see that there exists a single reason to believe that tool slots has resulted in fewer griefers.

Last edited by Spoonwood (2019-12-13 16:14:41)

MCzerotacos · 2019-12-13 16:48:09

Spoonwood wrote:

Have you ever played as a true Eve starting from scratch?

I have actually and to be frank with you, in Punkyval scenario about this village, it is not starting out as an eve so by logic what you said doesn't apply to the given scenario.

Spoonwood wrote:

Villages can be rather small sometimes. I don't think it appropriate that you rush to judgment like you did.

Define a village in your words for me because I was assuming a village would be maybe 10-15 people, and with those numbers and in this scenario there should at least be a sheep farm. With a sheep farm comes the ability to sustain the village and make pads. Not hard to do so. However, I would like to know what you consider a village to be to clear this matter up.

Spoonwood wrote:

Tool slots are not jobs. The tool slot system is not a job system.

If it sounded like I said tools slots are jobs that is not what I meant. What I meant was when using a tool, that gave you as a player, a certain job to fulfill. Although the current reason why tool slots were added was to give player a different experience each life.

Last edited by MCzerotacos (2019-12-13 16:52:21)

Spoonwood · 2019-12-13 17:36:31

MCzerotacos wrote:

Define a village in your words for me because I was assuming a village would be maybe 10-15 people, and with those numbers and in this scenario there should at least be a sheep farm. With a sheep farm comes the ability to sustain the village and make pads. Not hard to do so. However, I would like to know what you consider a village to be to clear this matter up.

A village has a sheep pen, a kiln, an oven, a wheat farm (or threshed wheat), a berry farm, and a carrot farm (or seeds). They also have gotten arranged appropriately for people to use (not necessarily ideally, but such that can get used without too much trouble... all those objects directly adjacent to each other does not make a village, it just makes an eyesore). I don't see why you would assume that villages have 10-15 people in them. Someone can discover a dead village where no one lives in it. Even a dead village is still a village. No, a sheep farm is not sufficient to make pads. Even assuming that shears have to exist for an Eve camp to transition to a village, shears can break. A village is no longer a village if it there's only one pair of shears and they break. A village can also be a village without a steel file existing any longer in it. If there is no steel file and no shears in the village, nor any chisel also, and heck we could even suppose that the only hammer broke or is missing, well, I'm not so sure we can say accurately that it's easy to make pads.

MCzerotacos wrote:

What I meant was when using a tool, that gave you as a player, a certain job to fulfill.

So what's the job if you use a shovel to dig up tule stumps? Or when you dig up big hard rocks? Or when you use a froe and mallet to split a butt log into a board?

pedrito confesiones · 2019-12-14 03:47:59

is mczerotacos jason's alt? LOL

arkajalka · 2019-12-14 11:03:30

XD

Cant say anything else but GG WP Tim Winters.

If you did this really solo, without any sort of bug abuse thats sort of an achievement, with all the mechanics we have now. Killing is really hard with the slow system and people actually knowing how to use pads and healing stuff, you actually need to mess up in several fields to die.

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-12-12 21:46:12

Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#2 2019-12-12 22:18:14

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#3 2019-12-12 22:56:16

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#4 2019-12-13 14:46:00

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#5 2019-12-13 15:20:40

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#6 2019-12-13 16:12:24

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#7 2019-12-13 16:48:09

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#8 2019-12-13 17:36:31

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#9 2019-12-14 03:47:59

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

#10 2019-12-14 11:03:30

Re: Problems with killing: Destruction of a town & genocide of a clan.

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