The Caveman With the AK-47

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 03:08:26

Making this post to bring up a concern that ive noticed within the community, and that is that while the content being put out is good, the best way i can explain it is being out of order. What do i mean by out of order, well to put it simply we are metaphorically, giving cavemen AK-47's. Now i know that can be a little extreme of a comparison but when you look at the updates that are coming out its not that hard to assume that is the direction we are going.

First i wanna get out of the way a few eras. The Bronze age,the western era, and other eras that were locallized in a specific region of the world. For gameplay purposes making a 1.1 replication of the history of humanity is a horrible idea, even more so when the game only lets you live for just an hour, with so many obscure inventions and ideas forcing any player to learn them all would be more like a history lesson then a gaming experience so for the sake of entertainment i can understand that.

However with some of these additions into content it feels like Jason might of skipped over stuff a bit too far. Starting with the newcomen engines, these were said to of been made around 1712. Now up to this point the most earliest invention that we have to compare with this is the iron tool that was dated as far back as 1000BC. If there is some newer invention i am not bringing up forgive me but for now im going to use this as an example. Considering both inventions date of conception that is a time gap of 2,712 years! Hundreds if not thousands of inventions have been created in the span of so many years, and while all might not be relevant to the game, its hard to deny that at least a few could very well have a meaningful impact on the gameplay of, well, the game.

With such a grand leap in time forwards between each invention, its not hard to assume that now looking backwards instead we would find the same outcome. Indeed there are grand gaps in time between inventions but that itself can be mostly attributed to exponentiall growth of inventions, where the closer you are to present day, the more inventions there are. However what really troubles me is what im not seeing. Irrigation systems, anvils, and improved medicine all seemingly nonexistent in a game about building a better civilization. If you were to say this is because these inventions were not important overall to the advancement of humanity i would have to disagree, irrigation systems allowed for more conveint food production which lead to an increased population for those societies that created them, anvils made making advanced tools more convenient leading to an increase in production in all layers of society that required tools. That includes farming, warfare, building, etc.. Lastly there is improved medicine, its not hard to assume how more advanced medicine could benifit a society vs. one that doesn't have it, a society that is makes taking care of their people more conveniently will result in a increased life expectancy, and as a result more people were alive longer to contribute more to their society as a whole.

Comparing this to some of the more recent inventions like the newcomen engine, car, and radio, all of these inventions were never and are not in-game vital to your society as a whole. The newcomen engine while making for a good well pump is otherwise unneeded if enough ponds are nearby to keep your town afloat. Cars are more of a oddity then provide any real use, most civs that own them are already extremely self sufficient and as a result this invention does not contribute to the overall core aspect of the game. Finally the radio, while it may be cool to talk to other villages i have never witnessed two towns ever get advanced enough to the point where they can actively communicate with one another, and so what if they do? Towns are too far away from each other to have any meaningful effect on one another, or even care as at this point both towns already can support themselves without the aid of other towns so this only serves about as much purpose as the playing cards and rubber balls.

Meanwhile earlier important inventions are getting neglected and as a result making these high end inventions becomes more of a impossibility then they otherwise should be. Imagine how easy it would be to make a car if you didnt have to water everyone of your crops every 10 minutes. In humanity automation is what pushed us forward, so seeing these staple inventions being ignored in favor of more flashy and wow factor ones makes me feel like the game has turned more into a "oh wow look what you can make with this" instead of a "ok i need to get xy and z if im gonna progress my leiniage". I mean honestly, who thinks the whole of their leinage is going to depend on making that one car thats probably going to get stolen and lost 5 minutes after being made?

In short Jason has skipped important inventions of humanity and has instead opted to start going full steam ahead into more and more modern inventions, and as a result we have all been turned into high tech cavemen, with AK-47's.

Last edited by Crumpaloo (2019-01-19 03:10:17)

Dodge · 2019-01-19 05:39:05

Nice essay but watch the trailer again https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT4JktcVQuE

We are REBUILDING the civilisation, which means something like an apocalypse occured (lore is not clear yet, if there is even one) and we are rebuilding from scratch, so historic time periods are irrelevant, we dont even know if they are humans (think about it eve spawning from nowhere and popping babies out of thin air)

We could have a whole year of updates with prehistoric or medieval stuff but that would become very uninteresting and redundant

Turnipseed · 2019-01-19 05:51:33

Its a game where 1 minute is one year dont push realism too far or you will be eating every 15 seconds or you will die. Do you really want it to take 10 hours to make metal?

Grim_Arbiter · 2019-01-19 13:03:10

Hey, I am a high tech cavemen with AK-47! Really though we are primitive yet advanced as a human race.

Dodge wrote:

Nice essay but watch the trailer again https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT4JktcVQuE
We are REBUILDING the civilisation, which means something like an apocalypse occured (lore is not clear yet, if there is even one) and we are rebuilding from scratch, so historic time periods are irrelevant, we dont even know if they are humans (think about it eve spawning from nowhere and popping babies out of thin air)
We could have a whole year of updates with prehistoric or medieval stuff but that would become very uninteresting and redundant

Agreed

I've kinda always saw us as people versions of amoebas or like some kind of group cell creature with individually short lifespans that can regenerate, but not very well sometimes...

I personally think we ARE rebuilding from a way older civilization in the real world but it isn't accepted by main stream archaeology yet but things like Gunung Padang and Göbekli Tepe are starting to sway the timeline. Whoever built great pyramid or the Baalbek foundations would be like the vets of this game. Then something like an apocalypse happened while simultaneously us steam players on release were coming in and somehow only massive builds survived.

My parents live out in the boonies, and I was checking out where they live on google earth last night for the hell of it. I was checking out the little airport they are rebuilding and man this pic reminds me so much of this game haha. Maybe Im playing it too much..

Last edited by Grim_Arbiter (2019-01-19 13:21:49)

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 14:13:32

Dodge wrote:

Nice essay but watch the trailer again https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT4JktcVQuE
We are REBUILDING the civilisation, which means something like an apocalypse occured (lore is not clear yet, if there is even one) and we are rebuilding from scratch, so historic time periods are irrelevant, we dont even know if they are humans (think about it eve spawning from nowhere and popping babies out of thin air)
We could have a whole year of updates with prehistoric or medieval stuff but that would become very uninteresting and redundant

Yeah rebuilding civilization, and if i were trying to rebuild a civilization, and get it the way it once was, i would need alot of time, but how am i suppose to have all that time to advance civilization if im having to manually water my crops every 5 minutes like a dang cave man who doesn't know advanced agriculture?

Last edited by Crumpaloo (2019-01-19 14:14:07)

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 14:19:02

Turnipseed wrote:

Its a game where 1 minute is one year dont push realism too far or you will be eating every 15 seconds or you will die. Do you really want it to take 10 hours to make metal?

Jason said himself that realism was one of his goals about the game, so obviously hes gonna have to put some of that aside for gameplay sake. 1 to 1 replication of multiple eras are something that i completely abhor for the game to do, yet i dont think its that hard to look back before cars were made and see some inventions that could of had a staggering impact on human civilization positively and thus the gameplay as a whole wouldn't you agree?

Dodge · 2019-01-19 14:39:52

@Crumpaloo In terms of actual content what do you think jason skipped over too far? (actual content not just vague statement)

Also keep in mind that since it's not linear he will probably add a lot of historically more ancient stuff later in the game, chances are we're getting pyramids after robots or spears after guns

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 15:24:12

Dodge wrote:

@Crumpaloo In terms of actual content what do you think jason skipped over too far? (actual content not just vague statement)
Also keep in mind that since it's not linear he will probably add a lot of historically more ancient stuff later in the game, chances are we're getting pyramids after robots or spears after guns

I actually did make a few examples, the invention of irrigation allowed humanity to not have to put more work in for less food. As a result food production rised and as a result the population increased as there was more food to support them. More people allowed for bigger towns which means more people in one place to share more ideas and create more inventions.

The anvil allowed for advanced tool smiting which allowed for more complex inventions and building. I know the flat rock acts as a makeshift anivl, but with people stealling a flatrock to make eggs, tacos, burritos, or roads at any point, a more reliable and greif free way of crafting tools would be very nice. Maybe Jason could even make it so that with an anvil you can craft more complex mechanics that THEN can be used towards stuff higher on the tech tree.

The last point i made was towards advanced medicine, keeping your population healthy and alive is alot more important then a moterized automobile so it would make since for there to be an easier way to heal your fellow villagers then having to do it step by step. Maybe introduce a medical kit that contains a needle and thread as well as wool pads that whenever used on someone with a specific injury instantly gets padded and sewn.

All of these being inventions that existed before the conception of automobiles yet are vastly more important then cars themselves. My argument is that these older inventions while being around for alot longer would have more of a affect on survival gameplay rather then the commodity version of inventions that have been released previous with the updates that introduced the radio and cars. I explain a little more in depth as to why these inventions are not that big in terms of core gameplay in the post itself if you wanna have a look see.

Dodge · 2019-01-19 16:21:39

@Crumpaloo So irrigations,anvils and medicine?

For irrigation how do you think this could be technically implemented with the current system we have ? And also what about soil?
Wouldnt it be better to have farming machines like tractors with engines, you could load them with soil,water or a tilling tool to industrialise farming

Anvils would be redundant but why not, seems like an aesthetic update if it doesnt allow to do more than the flat rock

I agree for better medicine a way to carry sterile pads to have actual medics since we already have a medical apron and pain medicine maybe to die slower and give more time to heal wounds

Is your post more about aesthetics and the "feeling" of not being a caveman and having preshistorical looking objects/constructions/clothing etc and less about technically new usable stuff?

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 17:06:29

Dodge wrote:

@Crumpaloo So irrigations,anvils and medicine?
For irrigation how do you think this could be technically implemented with the current system we have ? And also what about soil?
Wouldnt it be better to have farming machines like tractors with engines, you could load them with soil,water or a tilling tool to industrialise farming
Anvils would be redundant but why not, seems like an aesthetic update if it doesnt allow to do more than the flat rock
I agree for better medicine a way to carry sterile pads to have actual medics since we already have a medical apron and pain medicine maybe to die slower and give more time to heal wounds
Is your post more about aesthetics and the "feeling" of not being a caveman and having preshistorical looking objects/constructions/clothing etc and less about technically new usable stuff?

Architecture and intern aesthetics has always been an important tool in dating the age of humanities development, imagine how confused an archaeologist would be if they found a prehistoric iPhone dated to be from that time. But along with aesthetics needs to come functionality otherwise it will all feel hollow. As it stands right now the aesthetics of radios and cars are vastly out matched by the amount of cost, time, and functionality. So if we are going to get new historical inventions, i feel like they should also have the same weight of functionality as cost, and as it stands that is not the case.

I have a post on the reddit and forums about irrigation and how it would be implemented, its a little old though and i dont know if it would be ok to link that from this post but i assume that it shouldn't be too hard to find it.

Dodge · 2019-01-19 18:25:47

Crumpaloo wrote:

Dodge wrote:
@Crumpaloo So irrigations,anvils and medicine?
For irrigation how do you think this could be technically implemented with the current system we have ? And also what about soil?
Wouldnt it be better to have farming machines like tractors with engines, you could load them with soil,water or a tilling tool to industrialise farming
Anvils would be redundant but why not, seems like an aesthetic update if it doesnt allow to do more than the flat rock
I agree for better medicine a way to carry sterile pads to have actual medics since we already have a medical apron and pain medicine maybe to die slower and give more time to heal wounds
Is your post more about aesthetics and the "feeling" of not being a caveman and having preshistorical looking objects/constructions/clothing etc and less about technically new usable stuff?
Architecture and intern aesthetics has always been an important tool in dating the age of humanities development, imagine how confused an archaeologist would be if they found a prehistoric iPhone dated to be from that time. But along with aesthetics needs to come functionality otherwise it will all feel hollow. As it stands right now the aesthetics of radios and cars are vastly out matched by the amount of cost, time, and functionality. So if we are going to get new historical inventions, i feel like they should also have the same weight of functionality as cost, and as it stands that is not the case.
I have a post on the reddit and forums about irrigation and how it would be implemented, its a little old though and i dont know if it would be ok to link that from this post but i assume that it shouldn't be too hard to find it.

Why would it be not ok to link it in post?

With the current game engine i dont see exactly how this could be done since there is no tile interraction, except the rail cart maybe i guess he could do a system similar do the rail cart like a steel pipe on each berry that goes to the water pump you would still need to use soil on it tho

Lily · 2019-01-19 18:57:06

The thing is, he isn't really putting stuff in, in order. So I absolutely agree that it seems like we are getting stuff far too advanced compared to the current level of tech in the game, but he is probably going to add in more older tech too. I think the end result will be a more smooth and gradual increase in complexity as tech advances. Over the sort term, this is what you get though.

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 19:06:05

Lily wrote:

The thing is, he isn't really putting stuff in, in order. So I absolutely agree that it seems like we are getting stuff far too advanced compared to the current level of tech in the game, but he is probably going to add in more older tech too. I think the end result will be a more smooth and gradual increase in complexity as tech advances. Over the sort term, this is what you get though.

Looking at it from an updates perspective, majority of the updates are about higher and higher tech inventions, i have not seen any updates thus far discussing an invention being released whose origin was dictated to be before, or around the same time the newest inventions that so far were made during that time in the game. So with not much information or insight into that specifically, i dont find it hard to assume that these inventions will continue to get more and more advanced for how long im not sure.

Like im not expecting a content calendar, but maybe a response to this issue itself would help clear up any misunderstandings right?

Last edited by Crumpaloo (2019-01-19 19:08:44)

Lily · 2019-01-19 19:25:07

That is more or less true of recently if you are looking at the last month or two, but if you go further back it is a more of a mix hoping back and forth. It just seems recently he has been interested in these more advanced stuff. He has always been a bit unpredictable, so who knows what he might do next. I am fairly certain there will be more early stuff added later though.

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 19:37:58

Lily wrote:

That is more or less true of recently if you are looking at the last month or two, but if you go further back it is a more of a mix hoping back and forth. It just seems recently he has been interested in these more advanced stuff. He has always been a bit unpredictable, so who knows what he might do next. I am fairly certain there will be more early stuff added later though.

Agreed, we are bound to get to get early stuff added later, but that "later" is pretty hard to pin down. You said yourself hes a bit unpredictable so whose to say we could be getting atomic robots next month? Thats an exaggeration but i dont think were that far off from the reality that is these recent updates. Most of them being more or less needless knick knacks that dont contribute to the betterment of a village as a whole right? Yeah, cars and radios might be interesting, but are they functional/priority, that i cant attest to.

So if we are gonna get advanced stuff, or primitive stuff, either way its not asking much to have a consistent cost/functionality ratio with these latest invention implementations right?

Crumpaloo · 2019-01-19 19:43:58

Dodge wrote:

Crumpaloo wrote:
Dodge wrote:
@Crumpaloo So irrigations,anvils and medicine?
For irrigation how do you think this could be technically implemented with the current system we have ? And also what about soil?
Wouldnt it be better to have farming machines like tractors with engines, you could load them with soil,water or a tilling tool to industrialise farming
Anvils would be redundant but why not, seems like an aesthetic update if it doesnt allow to do more than the flat rock
I agree for better medicine a way to carry sterile pads to have actual medics since we already have a medical apron and pain medicine maybe to die slower and give more time to heal wounds
Is your post more about aesthetics and the "feeling" of not being a caveman and having preshistorical looking objects/constructions/clothing etc and less about technically new usable stuff?
Architecture and intern aesthetics has always been an important tool in dating the age of humanities development, imagine how confused an archaeologist would be if they found a prehistoric iPhone dated to be from that time. But along with aesthetics needs to come functionality otherwise it will all feel hollow. As it stands right now the aesthetics of radios and cars are vastly out matched by the amount of cost, time, and functionality. So if we are going to get new historical inventions, i feel like they should also have the same weight of functionality as cost, and as it stands that is not the case.
I have a post on the reddit and forums about irrigation and how it would be implemented, its a little old though and i dont know if it would be ok to link that from this post but i assume that it shouldn't be too hard to find it.
Why would it be not ok to link it in post?
With the current game engine i dont see exactly how this could be done since there is no tile interraction, except the rail cart maybe i guess he could do a system similar do the rail cart like a steel pipe on each berry that goes to the water pump you would still need to use soil on it tho

I just meant morally i dont think the post would get archived. But if your asking about it here: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=4836

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-01-19 03:08:26

The Caveman With the AK-47

#2 2019-01-19 05:39:05

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#3 2019-01-19 05:51:33

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#4 2019-01-19 13:03:10

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#5 2019-01-19 14:13:32

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#6 2019-01-19 14:19:02

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#7 2019-01-19 14:39:52

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#8 2019-01-19 15:24:12

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#9 2019-01-19 16:21:39

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#10 2019-01-19 17:06:29

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#11 2019-01-19 18:25:47

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#12 2019-01-19 18:57:06

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#13 2019-01-19 19:06:05

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#14 2019-01-19 19:25:07

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#15 2019-01-19 19:37:58

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#16 2019-01-19 19:43:58

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