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a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building

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#1 2020-11-24 18:21:14

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,779

I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

I don't know who started it or who helped build it, but in Mushroom Gorge some people made a station with some flooring, some tables, and put objects on it.  There was a sign there that said "TRADE".  I don't know if there were any fish on the tables when Twisted came to town as a Garvey, and I'm not critiquing his choice to bring sulfur.  Even if he had known how old that place was by that point, sulfur could have helped for more/any rubber tire carts or if someone makes another engine for some reason.

But, and maybe this is just me, I'm sitting here laughing that he missed the station with it's sign that said "TRADE".  One might be forgiven for thinking that's just how the default view is likely to work.

Last edited by Spoonwood (2020-11-25 07:05:49)

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#2 2020-11-25 01:40:06

Cogito
Member
Registered: 2020-03-09
Posts: 147

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

The vanilla game lacks a lot of affordances that would facilitate better trade, and things like that.

It's hard to see enough of the world at once, and it's hard to find things you need. Zoom and search mods helps a lot with those two in particular.

Jason has introduced affordances that make some aspects of trade easier, like the changes that make finding trading partners easier. As it stands today, however, the support for 'local' infrastructure is really lacking - the only support we really have is the meta created by the community. For example, everyone knows that you go to the kitchen if you need food or clothes, and if they aren't there they will be in an adjoining room. We don't have any meta for a trading station, and it's hard to establish one.

I'm not sure what affordances built into the game might make it easier to establish a trade meta, or at least to enable ad-hoc trade, but a bigger field of view and better translation/communication would definitely help.

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#3 2020-11-25 05:13:16

NoTruePunk
Member
Registered: 2019-01-25
Posts: 306

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

Literally just let us make lettering with the chat. Holding a letter stock "kit" should reduce your character count limit to 1 letter, then the kit should become whatever letter you write. That's basically how player made way stones work.

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#4 2020-11-25 05:22:09

DestinyCall
Member
Registered: 2018-12-08
Posts: 4,122

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

Proper signage would make a world of difference.  It is so hard to get people to carry on your legacy if they have no clue what you were trying to achieve.   

Most of the time, the only way to get anything done is by doing everything yourself for several lifetimes, so that you have the time to build the necessary infrastructure AND so people how to use it by example or teaching.   But if you are trying to create a trading spot or a tailor shop or a carpentry station, it only maintains its identity until the resources are depleted.   After that, it is just a bunch of random boxes and tables.   Nobody will know what it is for or why it exists.

Unless you spend another lifetime building a sign, one letter at a time ...

More fixed location crafting stations would also be good.  The bakery and smithy exist because adobe ovens and kilns are part of the game.   If we had other fixed stations, that would help demonstrate the intended purpose of an area in the village AND give you a reason to transport resources to a specific place for further processing.

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#5 2020-11-25 07:05:40

Spoonwood
Member
Registered: 2019-02-06
Posts: 3,779

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

DestinyCall wrote:

More fixed location crafting stations would also be good.  The bakery and smithy exist because adobe ovens and kilns are part of the game.   If we had other fixed stations, that would help demonstrate the intended purpose of an area in the village AND give you a reason to transport resources to a specific place for further processing.

I agree, but I want to argue that, that they shouldn't get fixed too early.  Doing such, I think, would result in pre-optimization and be counterproductive.  Like, Eve camps these days tend to have a kiln close to the spring/well.  So much so that it can get tight to fire clay or make iron tools.  I might disagree with others on exact kiln position placement in an Eve camp, but I think the approach of keeping things tight like that is the right approach early on.  It saves on movement time, and more people in an early camp can cook, farm, and process iron and clay more quickly that way.  Later on fixed crafting stations makes more sense.  And yes, more fixed crafting stations would help with organization. 

Twisted did go to a later stage place for sure, so your comment makes sense in context.

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#6 2020-11-25 09:04:50

DestinyCall
Member
Registered: 2018-12-08
Posts: 4,122

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

The kiln and oven are really easy to relocate.   You can place them in a spot that makes sense for an Eve camp, then later on, when the camp has grown into a village, you can always move them to a more optimized location or build a second kitchen/forge and let people decide which one works better.     Any additional crafting stations that get added should also be moveable or destructible with some amount of effort.   Immovable objects are troublesome because it is easy for people to put them in the wrong place, accidentally or on purpose. 

Ideally, a crafting station should require some amount of effort to construct, but pay out over the long-run by making your life easier.   The adobe oven opens up all kinds of food options, as well as being highly useful for rubber production during the mid to late game.   The adobe kiln/forge is critically necessary for iron and clay processing, as well as charcoal generation.   I'd love to see other stations, like a woodworking bench, additional tailoring options, like thread or rope making, and whatever else Jason can imagine.   There are many options.

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#7 2020-11-25 15:32:29

NoTruePunk
Member
Registered: 2019-01-25
Posts: 306

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

This "Stations" idea is fairly clever. A self explanatory area in a village with a dedicated purpose.

Here's one: fire pit

Small trash pit + cut stones = fire pit

Hot embers last longer

Another: paper mill

For batch processing shavings and water into paper.

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#8 2020-11-25 15:34:21

NoTruePunk
Member
Registered: 2019-01-25
Posts: 306

Re: I Guess Even A Trading Station Doesn't Work?

Being able to make dedicated storage would also go a long way. "Clothing boxes" that only hold clothing, "food boxes" that only hold food, etc. And the slotted variants of each. That would also prevent people from putting clay plates back in the pie box.

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