a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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Things that I consider rude:
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* Taking kindle out of any oven/kiln. Seriously somebody put it there for a reason and I know everybody considers their current project the most important one, but seriously taking it for example out of the kiln to put in your oven or as fire starter is just rude.
* Standing around in the smithy. Smithy needs fast movement to be efficient. Lollygagging within the smithy (area) is just pestering the smithy for no reason.
* Taking a flat stone or round stone out of the smithy. Similar reason, if you want to make fried eggs get another flat stone, don't take the one out of the smithy.
* Taking the round or sharpened stone from the bakery. Same as smithy.
* Making baskets out of straw unless if there isn't on every field one ready made compost already (or ok at early upstart from wild straw)
* Making locks. Nothing good gets ever out of them, unless maybe for signs. Everything else, just wasting iron and causing trouble.
* Standing in the cold, raising your kids and pick them up every second... then munch up a whole mutton pie every other minute... (okay this is likely just not-knowing-better-ness).
* Carrying a knife, not doing anything knife related jobs when, while there is a need piling up. If you are the only person with a knife -- "for security" -- and skinned sheep pile up in the pen, and uncut bread in the bakery, you're doing it wrong.
Things that I consider close to griefing already:
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And thus might me put people on the watchlist and if they don't stop after one warning, getting a knifing. Also combined (tell them off on one of these things and see them do another soon later). Or if I just had another bad experience a knifing right away.
* Breeding dogs. As of the game mechanics there is no use of them, not even lasting decorative. It wastes resources, fills bowls with hard to get rid of carnitas and has a high chance you're doing this only to make a mean pit bull attack. Or a wolf farm to kite into the village.
* Making bowls of carnitas. Same reason unless there is a convincing effort visible to make tacos. And in this case I will watch closely that person actually make tacos and not dogs.
* Sheering the last sheep. Even if there is the odd chance to hit a newbie with this, I've more than once a griefer acting hypocritical innocent when caught "oh I didn't know, sry." Then 3 minutes later they do it again...
* Cutting down any juniper tree. I don't care if there is another available. Cutting them down makes fire making much harder and every juniper tree cut maybe by a good intentioned person because the other is not far or even nearer, just makes the job for a potential griefer much easier.
* Same for maple. Cut down a maple tree and you'll be in trouble. (Albeit in contrast to junipers they could regrown)
* Carrying more than one knife. There may be the odd chance you found one in the wild while you had one. Or there are really only trouble makers around. But the town would be better off distributing it to busy workers (who are obviously productive). Generally I'll assume you want to starve the town of weapons just to prepare for a massacre...
* Taking the file or the smithing hammer out of the smithy.
Anything else?
Last edited by lionon (2018-12-07 15:36:07)
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Generally, taking anything from smithing area.
Breaking the pen in any way.
Stabbable offence - recycling non-broken tools into iron scrap.
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* When you are about to smith, and you position like 3 separate big rocks, and then they stack the 3 big rocks together -_-
* When you are about to put dough on plates, so you position 4 separate plates, and they stack them together -_-
* When you don't have rabbit bones yet, so you make a secondary fire to cook the rabbit on hot coals, and they either make it a second big fire, or put a big rock on it really fast as soon as its hot coals.
* When you bring berries to make them into seeds, and they eat the berries
* People who ask for "job?" but don't know how to do anything, so even if you do give them a job they won't be able to do it.
* People who stand there watching you work for extended period of time.
* People who waste time chatting about useless shit.
* People who abandon their kids and force you to feed them, without asking for it first.
* People who make bread or carrot pies when we have like 50 raw muttons sitting there.
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Oh yes, people throwing a flat rock on the fire you just made to roast a rabbit/goose are terrible. The bread thing can have one exception if the berry farm is currently broken (out of whatever reason) *one* bread for kids and elder is reasonable even if you have mutton. Or yes people that think it's a good idea to maintain two large fires at the same time...
Other thing:
* Eating carrots.
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Just in general taking tools from where they were (if they are useful there) and not putting them back.
- Farm needs a basket so soil can be taken out.
- Farm needs bowls for water and soil, don't take the bowls from farm area and never bring them back.
- Stew station needs a lot of tools, don't take from an active stew maker, or at least return when you are done.
- Stew pots need a bowl next to it! Don't take the bowl next to the stew pot. Similarly, if you eat the last bite of stew, immediately refill the bowl and put it back so nobody takes all the bowls from the stew pot.
- Most people start with the home marker. So why take the stones from home marker and make every player after you run around looking for stones?
IMO
- Shovel should always stay near entrance of sheep pen.
- Hoe should always stay in more or less the same place, centralish to the carrot/wheat/milkweed farms. Don't use and leave on the far end of the farm when you are finished, someone will have to run around the whole farm to find it.
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Oh yes, people throwing a flat rock on the fire you just made to roast a rabbit/goose are terrible. The bread thing can have one exception if the berry farm is currently broken (out of whatever reason) *one* bread for kids and elder is reasonable even if you have mutton. Or yes people that think it's a good idea to maintain two large fires at the same time...
Other thing:
* Eating carrots.
Just to clarify, i'm talking about towns where there is so much raw mutton that they will never run out of it. In this case, mutton pies are just SO MUCH BETTER than bread its not close. Its essentially 1 bread vs 4 mutton pies. Bread also use up your knives.
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I taught knives are indestructible.
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I taught knives are indestructible.
Oh i could be wrong about that. But even then, 4 mutton pies > 1 bread.
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* Taking kindle out of any oven/kiln. Seriously somebody put it there for a reason and I know everybody considers their current project the most important one, but seriously taking it for example out of the kiln to put in your oven or as fire starter is just rude.
Disagree. Kindling-dependent projects are often critical and urgent, and there is often a kindling shortage (due to mismanagement). It's a good idea to leave kindling in ovens and kilns, but ovens and kilns are very often idle. So if you urgently need to start a fire, and the only kindling around is in an oven that no one is working at right now then go ahead and take it.
* Making baskets out of straw unless if there isn't on every field one ready made compost already (or ok at early upstart from wild straw)
Disagree. Baskets are very often in tragically short supply (usually because the bakers are wasting them on raw mutton and raw rabbit, instead of locating the bakery with an edge adjacent to open terrain and then leaving their raw supply spread out over the ground). Whereas wheat is usually either in two states - there's essentially none at all and the compost cycle is in danger, or compost is working well and there's a TON of it being grown. If the latter is true, go ahead and make baskets. Make a TON of baskets. There's never enough bowls, baskets, boxes, and carts. Ever.
* Standing in the cold, raising your kids and pick them up every second... then munch up a whole mutton pie every other minute... (okay this is likely just not-knowing-better-ness).
As you say, this isn't rude, exactly, it's just ignorance. It's not at all obvious that picking up kids reduces your food by one pip every time you do it. It's not spelled out in the tutorial, and it's very easy to not notice it while you're still learning how to play. Everyone should be able to figure it out eventually, but like I say, it's not obvious.
Once you have figured it out and you keep doing it, it's not rude, it's just stupid.
Things that I consider close to griefing already [..] if they don't stop after one warning, getting a knifing.
* Breeding dogs. As of the game mechanics there is no use of them, not even lasting decorative. It wastes resources, fills bowls with hard to get rid of carnitas and has a high chance you're doing this only to make a mean pit bull attack. Or a wolf farm to kite into the village.
Get stuffed. I haven't learned how to breed dogs yet, nor had the time to do so (I stay really f*ing busy in every life so far), but I'll be goddamned if I'm not going to breed one the first chance I get. I may only ever do it once (when the novelty wears off), but F* YOU if you think I'm not allowed to take advantage of something fun and unique that Jason put in the game specifically to entertain people.
* Cutting down any juniper tree. I don't care if there is another available. Cutting them down makes fire making much harder and every juniper tree cut maybe by a good intentioned person because the other is not far or even nearer, just makes the job for a potential griefer much easier.
"Good-intentioned people might do this very reasonable-sounding thing, so I'll assume they're griefers and stab them."
Get stuffed.
If there are plenty of juniper trees still around, then there are plenty of extra that are better used as firewood than as a backup-backup-backup source of tinder.
You people are on f*ing power trips because you know the game better than other people. Get over yourselves.
Last edited by CrazyEddie (2018-12-07 16:25:37)
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* If you take out the last bucket of a pump, *always* put it back immediately.
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Disagree. Kindling-dependent projects are often critical and urgent, and there is often a kindling shortage (due to mismanagement). It's a good idea to leave kindling in ovens and kilns, but ovens and kilns are very often idle. So if you urgently need to start a fire, and the only kindling around is in an oven that no one is working at right now then go ahead and take it.
What is sooooo "critical and urgent" you have to disrupt what someone else just prepared? Only exception, drastic food shortage and you have tons of eggs lieing around.
Disagree. Baskets are very often in tragically short supply (usually because the bakers are wasting them on raw mutton and raw rabbit, instead of locating the bakery with an edge adjacent to open terrain and then leaving their raw supply spread out over the ground). Whereas wheat is usually either in two states - there's essentially none at all and the compost cycle is in danger, or compost is working well and there's a TON of it being grown. If the latter is true, go ahead and make baskets. Make a TON of baskets. There's never enough bowls, baskets, boxes, and carts. Ever.
Well is there compost or isn't. In case there isn't the basket you want to make cannot be more important. And even if there would be plenty of straw, why are you making that basket instead of compost? Well if you urgently need one, just take one from the bakery and put the pies on the ground. Still better than wasting that straw when it would urgently be needed for compost.
Get stuffed. I haven't learned how to breed dogs yet, nor had the time to do so (I stay really f*ing busy in every life so far), but I'll be goddamned if I'm not going to breed one the first chance I get. I may only ever do it once (when the novelty wears off), but F* YOU if you think I'm not allowed to take advantage of something fun and unique that Jason put in the game specifically to entertain people.
Well and I'm allowed in the game to stop you because of dog breeding, because it has zero use but being a griefers tool. It's not worth the risk. See and this kind of sullen reactions is why I don't warn or discuss in the game, but stab right away.. You can try again in another village or do it on an empty server all by yourself if you just need to see it.
If there are plenty of juniper trees still around, then there are plenty of extra that are better used as firewood than as a backup-backup-backup source of tinder.
As explained, you are just making the job for a griefer easier. You might be one that leaves the most inner juniper trees standing saying "but there are some"... and after you axed all of them far and wide you quickly cut down the innerst most before being able to be stopped.
Last edited by lionon (2018-12-07 16:32:06)
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Bread is better than mutton pie because it uses more grain per plate. If you're running out of plates and there's a ton of mutton and wheat, you're better off making bread and roast mutton than pies. That and mutton generally accumulates faster than it's spent, so trying to pie it all is a Sisyphean task. And leaving it just laying around cluttering tiles reduces efficiency of everything.
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There is no reason to run out of plates. Make more plates!
Mutton growing faster than spend is people doing too much berries and not enough baking.
Last edited by lionon (2018-12-07 16:34:29)
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When all nearby swamps are devoid of plates and I have babies to take care of? Yeah no.
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Lots of stuff in this thread is just griping. And legitimately so. I gripe when people take vital tools from their natural homes (not just the smithy! I consider the sharp stone and round stone next to the home marker to be vital tools that should never be removed!). I gripe when people take shared tools (like the hoe) and don't put them back where they got them. I gripe when someone drops a flat rock for eggs on the hot coals that I've been waiting for, especially when I'm standing right there with a skewered rabbit and a ton of rabbits just a few tiles over!
But griping is just griping. Newbies don't know any better so they do dumb stuff. Even some experienced players who ought to know better are just bad at the game. The game is stressful and the pace is hectic so even the best of players get careless or make mistakes or just plain don't notice something.
That's fine. That's life. Gripe about it and then get over it.
That doesn't mean that all of these inconveniences are rude. Or evidence of griefing. Some are, sure. But "people who waste time chatting about useless shit"? That's not rude, or griefing, or even something worth complaining about. That's just people who want to play this game differently than you do.
Get over yourself.
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Well and I'm allowed in the game to stop you because of dog breeding, because it has zero use but being a griefers tool. It's not worth the risk. See and this kind of sullen reactions is why I don't warn or discuss in the game, but stab right away..
You are a sociopath.
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Bread is better than mutton pie because it uses more grain per plate. If you're running out of plates and there's a ton of mutton and wheat, you're better off making bread and roast mutton than pies. That and mutton generally accumulates faster than it's spent, so trying to pie it all is a Sisyphean task. And leaving it just laying around cluttering tiles reduces efficiency of everything.
Bread is essentially 8x8 food, for 64 total. 4 mutton pies is 4x4x15, for 240 total. Same amount of wheat used. Now assuming you cooked those 4 raw mutton for 4x12, that still means 48+64 = 112 vs 240, very ineffective. Now about the argument that you are "saving plates"... Well 4 breads is 256 food and 4 mutton pie is 240 food, so that doesn't feel like a big plate saving there. And tbh its not necessary to have this many pies at the same time.
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No, seriously there is *no* legitimate use of dogs in the game on the one hand and a major griefers tool on the other hand. There is no balance, if e.g. chihuahuas would at least be a permanent decorative entity, but no they need to be fed to continue their life cycle. The difference is, I don't mind anybody doing bonsais...
If Jason wants them to be something for good intentioned town folk, either remove mean pit bulls or put in a good use that balances out the danger. If all they actually do is being there for griefers, because griefers are supposed to be part of the game to make it interesting, I'll assume you are one the moment you feed mutton to a wolf.. and apply my anti-griefing reactions... made it the more "interesting"?
The sociopaths are infact the griefers that get a power kick by seeing a village/town fall due to their action.
Last edited by lionon (2018-12-07 17:12:42)
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There is no reason to run out of plates. Make more plates!
Mutton growing faster than spend is people doing too much berries and not enough baking.
When i am the shepherd, i can literally INFEST the town of mutton meat everywhere. Its nearly impossible to bake faster than i can produce meat (and even if you fast enough, you would run out of plates). When i am the baker, the issue is i quickly run out of plates. But tbh once you have 20+ mutton pies stored up, the correct thing to do isn't to produce more plates, its to do more useful things, such as creating a nursery, making more roads, adding horse carts, creating clothes, etc.
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lionon wrote:There is no reason to run out of plates. Make more plates!
Mutton growing faster than spend is people doing too much berries and not enough baking.
When i am the shepherd, i can literally INFEST the town of mutton meat everywhere. Its nearly impossible to bake faster than i can produce meat (and even if you fast enough, you would run out of plates). When i am the baker, the issue is i quickly run out of plates. But tbh once you have 20+ mutton pies stored up, the correct thing to do isn't to produce more plates, its to do more useful things, such as creating a nursery, making more roads, adding horse carts, creating clothes, etc.
Yup, and in case you have 20+ mutton pies stored up, there is no use to make bread or bake mutton, because of no plates.
If mutton piles up, because of dung created for compost, then this must be used for too much berry eating instead of pies.
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No, seriously there is *no* legitimate use of dogs in the game on the one hand and a major griefers tool on the other hand. There is no balance, if e.g. chihuahuas would at least be a permanent decorative entity, but no they need to be fed to continue their life cycle. The difference is, I don't mind anybody doing bonsais...
If Jason wants them to be something for good intentioned town folk, either remove mean pit bulls or put in a good use that balances out the danger. If all they actually do is being there for griefers, because griefers are supposed to be part of the game to make it interesting, I'll assume you are one the moment you feed mutton to a wolf.. and apply my anti-griefing reactions... made it the more "interesting"?
The sociopaths are infact the griefers that get a power kick by seeing a village/town fall due to their action.
I think its not a bad idea for jason to add an use to dogs.
Pit Bull: Protection against bears
Poodle: Goose hunting, can bring back some goose in town.
Chihuahua:
Dachshund: Brings back rabbits
Airedale: Protection against wild animals, except bears.
Beagle: Can eat bones remains from old graves, as well as sheep bones
Collie: Will bring baby animals close to your home marker
German Shepherd: Will attack anyone that kills someone from your lineage, except lineage members.
Schnauser: Creates "dog dung" which has same use as sheep dung.
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Taking thread from hospital.
Recent favorite lives:
Favio Pheonix,Les Nana,Cloud Charles, Rosa Colo [fed my little bro] Lucas Dawn [husband of magnolia] Jasmine Yu,Chogiwa, Tae (Jazz meister)Gillian Yellow (adoptive husband),Jason Dua, Arya Stark, Sophie Cucci, Cerenity Ergo ,Owner of Boris The Goose,Being Maria's mom, Santa's helper.
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Bread is useful because old people and children can eat it. Like berries you pick a slice and eat it, it's easier to spot than a bowl of unknown mush (popcorn, beans), and you don't need that extra click of putting it down. Don't just leave in bakery to clutter, move loaf to high traffic areas or near farms and slice. This also helps educate newbies about easy food besides berries they can eat.
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When mutton (and wheat) piles up, it simply means two things: a) the compost cycle is working and b) the town is generating food faster than it is being consumed. These are both good things, and no corrective action is needed.
If people are eating berries instead of pies, that simply means that they are wasting soil on berry bushes that could be better used making thread, rope, baskets, saplings, and roses (all the other plants just make food). But note that there are legitimate reasons to eat berries instead of pies (chiefly youth and old age, but also in some cases convenience). And also note that even if no one ate anything but pies, there would still be surpluses of wheat and mutton because the town would still be capable of generating food faster than it gets consumed.
If food, thread, rope, baskets, saplings, and roses are all plentiful then it doesn't matter whether people eat berries or pies, and it doesn't matter whether mutton piles up or gets used. You're in a surplus. Enjoy it. Go spend time making roads and buildings and art instead of desperately struggling to feed a starving population.
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No, seriously there is *no* legitimate use of dogs in the game
Simply wanting a dog is a legitimate use. Not everything has to have instrumental value. Paint doesn't. Bonsais don't. Signs don't. Notes don't. Arguably, the entire "goal" of the game, to the extent one exists at all, is to build the infrastructure necessary to achieve the non-instrumental values.
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