It does tend to work pretty well in that regard, and I don't really run into too many problems with it. If I need something smithed and I'm working on clothing this life I just ask who's ever at the forge to make it. It also makes your job feel more valuable. If I'm cutting up kindling I know that there are at least some people who aren't able to do it.
My main gripe with it though is that instead of making players feel like they have "jobs" and giving some sort of role identity it simply relies on a system of finding someone who hasn't used up all their tool slots yet. If I want to have the produce I gathered cooked for example, it'd be more interesting to seek out a chef than someone young who still has slots to burn.
Creating advantages instead of penalties might work, but it runs the risk of players still doing everything themselves instead of handing things to the more experienced person. Many players REALLY don't like talking to people, and I can kind of understand. Typing things out to people and waiting for a response with the risk of them ignoring you slows down the pace of play in a game where you have so limited time and a limited amount of characters to type.
I sort of think it might be beneficial to add some sort of job postings board where players can easily without hassle post what they need created or gathered or maybe some type of quest creation system to negate this in a way. Basically anything that can deliver players requests to others through game mechanics if they so desire.
]]>This is what Jason wants us to do. I do this and I find I hardly ever have a tool slot shortage. Of course, it helps knowing what uses a slot and what does not. It is hard to plan out what you want to use slots on when there isn't a way to check what will use a slot and what will not until after it's too late (for a new player that doesn't know all this that is). That's what I'd like to see implemented. Some spot on your info bar that you could click and a pop up would appear showing you what you know and don't know, and how many slots still unassigned. Then when you pickup or mouse over an object, it should say (learned) or (unlearned) next to the object name, if it's something that takes a slot.
Easy right? So easy Jason probably won't ever do it.
]]>testo wrote:Racial lock was doomed from the start because it wasn´t designed to give each race something special to work with, it was designed as a restriction. The same happens with tool slots, the don´t incentive work specialization: they just block other jobs, which is frustrating and enraging, not rewarding and fullfilling.
Yes it would have been much better if it was designed to give advantages instead of restrictions. For example if you use one tool often you get better with it and can use it more efficient, maybe the tool has a lower chance to break and you can produce more stuff. (but you should not be forced to use one tool often to do something)
The same with races, advantages instead of restrictions and you should not be forced to be a certain race to do something.
Funny how many people can see some ideas as "common sense" and yet it still it is not enough...
I had almost the same idea in mind when tools where implemented, but I was focused on the idea of jobs more than tools. In my mind the idea is the same that everyone ends up with when facing tools: what is the skillset I need for what I want to do in this life? So basically instead of thinking of "blocked tools" I had in mind different small bonuses depending on the tools learnt that would construct a character skillset based on 3/4 tools. Example: using the firebow, oven, coals and knife and completing a target food crafting (idk different types of food? amount of pipes crafted? number of pies made?) enables you as a Baker Expert which makes the Oven last 30% more if you light it and killing sheep not hungry work after 40. Or maybe the food you craft gives 10% more pipes. Or maybe you get a bonus on the amount of dough per bowl of grain. Idk even just earning the title of "Baker Expert" seems fun.
]]>Racial lock was doomed from the start because it wasn´t designed to give each race something special to work with, it was designed as a restriction. The same happens with tool slots, the don´t incentive work specialization: they just block other jobs, which is frustrating and enraging, not rewarding and fullfilling.
Yes it would have been much better if it was designed to give advantages instead of restrictions. For example if you use one tool often you get better with it and can use it more efficient, maybe the tool has a lower chance to break and you can produce more stuff. (but you should not be forced to use one tool often to do something)
The same with races, advantages instead of restrictions and you should not be forced to be a certain race to do something.
Necro reported
News is news not olds
Calm your jets there Bucky. First of all, the original thread is only a couple months old, that's not really far back. Issues with family specialty are still one of the most highly discussed topics, so it's hardly a "dead topic" and it was Spoonwood who revived the thread anyway, and he's already serving a temp ban, so you reporting is pretty much like calling up the police to let them know about Jeffrey Dahmer. Makes it kind of ironic when you say "News is news not olds" however, which is amusing at least.
]]>News is news not olds
]]>But I do agree that family specialization failed to achieve its goal. In fact, it went down exactly as it was predicted by the forum when the idea was originally proposed. The core concept was flawed from the start. I don't see how any other outcome could have been expected. Long distance trade between villages was never going to be the best way to solve the problem created by family specialization. Coordinating trade between two isolated villages is a logistical nightmare, especially with the language barrier and lack of transport tech.
]]>Before this update families were mostly living separate because there wasn't that much reason to live with another family in the same town as there was no benefits and a few potential detriments to doing so.
This created some really interesting situations such as the whole suspicion of outsiders thing. Families couldn't speak the same language unless they grew up around each other so unless you were really given a chance with someone, it was very likely that you'd be killed if you entered another's territory due to not being able to say your intentions.
A lot of people would try to make peace, but others just wanted to kill anyone who wasn't in their family for fear of their own safety.
A few bad apples could go on murderous rampage which could tarnish another family's name for generations, making peace much harder because of it.
Now however families don't trade with each other like you want them to, they just live all together in the same towns so they have access to all the resources to become self sufficient. Nothing feels unique about them anymore. Everyone's all at peace, no one puts up property fencing around towns, and I have never once met someone that I didn't speak the same language as because every single town on the server has been multicultural for centuries. Negotiation and diplomacy aren't a thing anymore when they used to happen quite often.
]]>In case you missed this in another thread:
Taking a peak at the server population (really off hour but the point stands) we have four families which seems pretty good except we have some MAJOR problems.
-Two of the families are ginger, one is white, one is black. No browns at all on the server which means the tech tree can't be climbed any further than deep well. Once the whites/west side gingers run out of water they've got to move or fetch it.
-Holy shit are people way too spread. Pika gingers live 10k~ west of the bell, Fran whites live about 8k~ and Dobbie blacks + Kontz gingers live at or very close to the bell. How in Gods name are people supposed to trade or do anything if the needed specialty family (in this case dobbie or the nonexistent brown family) are that far away? Even once a brown family spawns the blacks are too far away to help them do anything and the gingers/whites are useless on their own basically.
I've seen some clues that these race restrictions don't seem to work out so well.
1. I watched a longterm Twitch streamer Wolvenscar, who plays the default client, comment that traveling was no longer fun. Even though horsecarts overcome the obstacles of the dropsy, unless your family is black, the dropsy isn't so fun.
2. Reports of people forming multiracial settlements. I've seen this on streams also as I recall. People choosing multiracial settlements I find great. It means that their culture isn't a prejudiced one. But, it's not trading.
3. Lava's post where he trades, but the family becomes multiracial rather quickly, which shows that trading isn't very efficent: https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8533
4. WomanWizard's comment where she says:
Those two times I tried to play around with some of the racially locked content (and I'm sorry Jason, but locking content behind race is highly problematic and "predicting people would get offended" doesn't excuse it), but then I was back to being white on the next go with nothing new to play around with.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=8569 I will note that she has streamed OHOL on Twitch in the past, as I've seen her play. She also states:
I like being in a different situation every time, possibly ending up with a newbie child who needs my guidance to get by. I enjoyed the challenge we had with the newbie boom, though admittedly that one time I ran away from home because we had no water and then popped out twenty-one kids in my new home (most of them new) was a little overwhelming.
She also told me once that though she did Eve runs only keeping children after preparing some basics for a camp, she would keep all children, because she kind of enjoyed the challenge from all the chaos of it or something like that. She also said things like "gotta heat them farmers" pre-temperature overhaul as I recall, a further clue that she's tried to really care about new players while also trying to have fun.
Personally speaking, I only found OHOL and played it because of some Twitch streamers. It has happened before that a Twitch streamer stopped playing and the reasons why seem clear. Specifically, a user named Buggy who had said on stream that she streamed the game because she wanted more to play it/because she thought they should. At the time she said:
The race war update is definitely ruining the game for me. I can't find my children if I leave them for a second because everyone in town looks the same, goodluck finding your own child on the baby fire. I have been learning how to use the freestanding Newcomen tower and now people can just turn my rods to swords when I am trying to make pipes. I don't want to not trust people based on their race that is a terrible feeling. The language barrier thing is funny for a bit, but then you realize in low pop servers you can't talk to your neighbours anymore. All the low pop servers were wiped too rip all the work put in there. I really liked playing a game where people were working together to build long lasting cities and lineages it is sad that the game is moving away from that to some warring clan game.
I saw her play a little after the server wipes... but she quit streaming and probably isn't playing at all. Even if she's playing, she's not streaming, so that's an update resulting in less out there.
So, I think you ignore a clue like that at your own peril.
Imagine this:
The apocalypse happened in such a way where some people had specialized knowledge survived. But, that knowledge was more about how well to do a particular task. For example, some Boots who survived the apocalypse had knowledge of *how to make* an object which some German who survived the apocalypse doesn't have. Such an object JUST improves the amount of resources that can get obtained from doing something. Like there's some object that Boots has knowledge to make which enables to get two tanks of kerosone from tarry spot instead of just one. That knowledge gets passed down through each generation also, even though Boots won't be applying that knowledge herself. People have changed such that they no longer can remember such pre-apoclyptic knowledge if they stand too far away from where some Boots, German, Bear, or Uno spawned (I don't quite like this... seems too silly even in a post-apocalyptic scenario, but it might limit multicultural settlements). Also, for some unknown reason when people pop into a post-apocalyptic world the first person would have knowledge on how to get more from a rubber tree, the second how to get more oil from a well, and so on.
Such a scenario would seem to enable modern people to still do things without being restricted by their race. It would involve more items appearing in the post-apocalyptic world. Those tools would increase efficiency of advanced tasks, so trading would be beneficial to such people. And multiple villages trading would be more useful than multiracial settlements, since people wandering away from where their primary ancestor when she survived the apocalypse would just make it less likely that the tools to increase efficiency could get made.
Anyways, maybe you find such a post-apocalyptic scenario interesting or useful Jason. It would also make sense since people have differed in their knowledge on the basis of what they were taught or learned before some disaster to their civilization.
Oh and people could do trading because it was useful to make their civilization and survival chances better. Trading might not so damn forced down people's throats. More like it would taste more sweet for a family to trade than to not trade. And as the saying goes, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.
]]>Jason, what happens if one of my children has a score above 60. Does that mean I'm getting a lower score no matter what I do? Even if (s)he lives to 60, that will be below their 60+ score.
It's based on a separate hidden average age, not their score. Nobody can live over 60, nevermind getting an average that high.
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